Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length (Read 20700 times)
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CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Mar 11th, 2015 at 3:02am
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I appealed my CIA clearance denial last January 2014 by responding to the SOR. Does any know how long this appeal process will take?
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #1 - Mar 14th, 2015 at 7:48am
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It takes 2 years. And your appeal will be denied.  You'll be given one more chance to appeal to someone higher up, and that appeal will also be denied.  At that point the letter they send you will say something like "this is our final correspondence with you".  When I did it, I chose not to waste money on a lawyer and an in-person appearance.  I just wrote an appeal letter and moved on.  I was surprised to get the certified letter two years later from the good ol' agency.

Care to share your story?  Why was your clearance denied?  Did you polygraph and do your 3-day processing at the CIA Dulles Discovery Building in Chantilly VA?
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #2 - Mar 26th, 2015 at 11:18pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Hi Guest,

Have you responded to anyone of my previous posts on the CIA?

  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #3 - Mar 26th, 2015 at 11:27pm
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I applied for a personnel security assistant position with USIS which was a contractor position at the CIA. Basically I "failed" the polygraph on my first try. Then they interrogated me for 4 hours. They brought me back again for another "polygraph" and I failed that too. The adjudicators requested to speak with me but then ended up interrogating me for several more hours. They basically tried to make sound like I viewed illegal material willingly online. I was coerced into agreeing to their false allegations.
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #4 - Mar 28th, 2015 at 1:15am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
I probably have responded to you before.  Which previous posts are you referring to?

I've been on and off of antipolygraph.org for years, under different screen names and ip addresses, always careful to conceal my identity. 

1. When and where (dulles discovery?) did your CIA  poly take place?
2. What exactly did they make you confess to? Was it viewing illegal material online, what type of material?
3. Did you get that letter saying you were denied access to classified info?
4. Did they make you sign a piece of paper regarding your confession?

I too failed a couple of back to back CIA polygraphs.  Same routine as described in TLBTLD.  Only I never confessed, but they accused me of using countermeasures and rejected me.  I bet the CIA is still using their same old tricks after all these years.
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #5 - Mar 30th, 2015 at 2:24am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Hi moving on,

I'm referring to this post I wrote:
Did you go by "another CIA reject"?


CIA Polygraph Thoughts
Apr 19th, 2014 at 11:55pm Mark & Quote Quote  I wrote these thoughts about the CIA polygraph after having gone through the process myself and had my clearance denied.

//I’ve been doing some research on the use of the polygraph in a certain agency of the federal government, and I have come to the firm moral conviction that it should be banned to protect the innocent. Some helpful open source readings that have lead me to this conclusion are:

The Gatekeeper: Memoirs of a CIA Polygraph Examiner
The Value of the Polygraph in CIA’s Personnel Security Program
What Federal Applicants Should Know about Polygraph Tests
US polygraphs way beyond tests, close to unlawful interrogation
Based upon these public resources, I have written down some principles for innocent people who might receive false positives and are hence interrogated.

Why the CIA’s Polygraph Program should be eliminated
1. Innocent people who are trustworthy, loyal, of good conduct and highly qualified can and do make false confessions. Why?

Innocent people can be placed under so much psychological pressure and stress, that they exaggerate the severity of their conduct or say something false and incriminating about themselves in order to satisfy their interrogators and be free to leave. (See: False Confessions)
Under the right conditions and with the heavy use of interrogation tactics and psychological manipulation, innocent people can begin to believe that they are guilty of conduct that they have actually not committed. (See: Internalized False Confessions)
2. It violates our Fourth Amendment Right to Privacy. If an applicant “fails” the polygraph he is given only two options: either he can walk out the door and lose the job offer, or he must submit himself to an excruciating session of interrogation where he must disclose his most personal and private conduct. The polygraph post-test amounts to psychological rape.

Principles to keep in mind
1. No one is rejected simply based upon not being successful with the polygraph exam.
Note: By “not being successful/failing” the polygraph, I only mean the polygraph detecting areas of concern to the polygrapher. Polygraphers give applicants, who do not show physiological reactions, the benefit of a doubt and give them a “pass.”

2. The polygraph is not able to detect lies, it only measures physiological reactions to specific questions. They have burden to prove that the rising of the physiological reactions correlates only with lying.

3. The CIA uses the polygraph to assist the adjudicator in making adjudicative decisions by obtaining confessions of personal conduct that they could not know simply based upon the SF-86 background check.

4. Keep in mind the top 3 principles, and do not trust the polygrapher. Their only objective is to elicit unfavorable information from you by means of psychological manipulation and deceit.

How to “pass” it
1. Do not say anything that the polygrapher and adjudicator could use against you to deny you your security clearance. Whatever you say can and will be used against you. Treat the polygraph interview as a job interview. (See:13 adjudicative guidelines.)//

  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #6 - Mar 30th, 2015 at 2:34am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
To answer your questions:

1. When and where (dulles discovery?) did your CIA  poly take place?

Yes, I took my polygraph at the dulles discovery building here: http://cryptome.org/2013-info/04/ciau-campus/ciau-campus.htm

I went up stairs into the polygraph/pre-employment procedure floor where I signed in and went into the waiting room near those stairs. They played a polygraph introduction video which described the polygraph as a calm and peaceful process. After the video played, that's when all the polygraphers came and took the applicants one by one to be polygraphed.

2. What exactly did they make you confess to? Was it viewing illegal material online, what type of material?

-they made me confess to illegal pornographic material. I was interrogated so intensively that I began having false memories and believing them to be true. The adjudicators also requested a meeting with me as well and they interrogated me even further. The questions they asked me I thought were inappropriate. One adjudicator asked me what ethnicities I had sexual attraction towards.

3. Did you get that letter saying you were denied access to classified info?
Yes, I received a Statement of Reasons about 2 months latter. This exact same one:  http://www.nationalsecuritylaw.org/files/received/CIA/Security_info-contractor_d...


4. Did they make you sign a piece of paper regarding your confession?

Fortunately, not.
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #7 - Mar 30th, 2015 at 9:49am
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Maybe I am "another cia reject"...or maybe not.  Wink

The adjudicators wanted to meet with you as well?  Wow, scary.  I never met the adjudicators.  I just got my security denial letters with their names signed on it, and then them signing letters denying my appeals.  I received the same letter that you linked above.  Yes, I also signed in upstairs (2nd Floor) in the Dulles Discovery Bldg, first name only, we watched this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4blyf5lTK6s

Then the polygraphers come grab their victims.  Sad to hear that they made you talk about your porn habits.  I was asked a leading indirect question about looking at porn and I replied "hell yeah, I look at porn!  Only at home though".  If they would have asked for more, I would have told them I prefer the softcore genre, curvy women naked in public and things like that. lol.

You'll get through this.  The good thing is now you know how the poly works and you can easily pass it next time.  Just deny all their accusations, don't confess, and relax and think of other things (mental countermeasures works great), and you'll be fine.  I lied my ass off on another later poly that I took elsewhere and passed with ease.
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #8 - Jun 18th, 2015 at 5:53pm
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My advice would be exactly the same as that indicated in the other responses.

Don't bother to appeal, and also don't bother to apply again, until at least your 130th birthday!  lol Grin
  

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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #9 - Jul 16th, 2015 at 4:42am
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Quote:
. Did you get that letter saying you were denied access to classified info?
Yes, I received a Statement of Reasons about 2 months latter. This exact same one:  http://www.nationalsecuritylaw.org/files/received/CIA/Security_info-contractor_d...



Who is this as*hole, Cecilia Elgin, whose name appears on the rejection notice?  I see that she has one of those many anonymous Agency PO Box addresses found all over Northern VA! Roll Eyes
  

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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #10 - Jul 16th, 2015 at 4:49am
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Quote:
It takes 2 years. And your appeal will be denied.  You'll be given one more chance to appeal to someone higher up, and that appeal will also be denied.  At that point the letter they send you will say something like "this is our final correspondence with you".  When I did it, I chose not to waste money on a lawyer and an in-person appearance.  I just wrote an appeal letter and moved on.  I was surprised to get the certified letter two years later from the good ol' agency.

Care to share your story?  Why was your clearance denied?  Did you polygraph and do your 3-day processing at the CIA Dulles Discovery Building in Chantilly VA?


When I was wasting my time going through the whole idiotic process, back in 1979, these things were all still being done at "Headquarters". Angry
  

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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #11 - Jul 16th, 2015 at 4:52am
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Quote:
I appealed my CIA clearance denial last January 2014 by responding to the SOR. Does any know how long this appeal process will take?


Don't hold your  breath! Smiley
  

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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #12 - Jan 23rd, 2016 at 2:20am
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It is 1/22/2016, and I still haven't heard back from the agency yet. I received the letter they stating they received my response to SOR on 1/2014. I was denied a clearance in 10/2013.
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #13 - Jan 25th, 2016 at 2:17pm
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Quote:
It is 1/22/2016, and I still haven't heard back from the agency yet. I received the letter they stating they received my response to SOR on 1/2014. I was denied a clearance in 10/2013.
                   


Have you tried writing your Congressman ?
  
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Re: CIA Clearance Denial Appeal Length
Reply #14 - Apr 11th, 2016 at 11:28am
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Quote:
It is 1/22/2016, and I still haven't heard back from the agency yet. I received the letter they stating they received my response to SOR on 1/2014. I was denied a clearance in 10/2013.


The Agency isn't noted for its promptness in responding to inquiries of that nature. Grin
  

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