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[skingalvanics]

Aunty is not only intelligent, she has a good heart.

Very obviously she does indeed.

Quickfix, on the other hand, more closely resembles Anatolii Golitsyn or James J. Angleton.  Those two men, one a KGB defector and the other the CIA Deputy Director of "Plans" respectively, caused severe harm to the CIA due to their incessant and paranoid obsession with the presence of "Soviet moles" inside Langley.

[Doug Williams]

Aunty is not only intelligent, she has a good heart.

Very obviously she does indeed.

Quickfix, on the other hand, more closely resembles Anatolii Golitsyn or James J. Angleton.  Those two men, one a KGB defector and the other the CIA Deputy Director of "Plans" respectively, caused severe harm to the CIA due to their incessant and paranoid obsession with the presence of "Soviet moles" inside Langley.

Skingalvanics – You make a great point here about the con men like Quickfix and his fellow polygraph operators.  They present a major threat to our national security.   With their fraudulent claims concerning the accuracy and validity of the polygraph as a lie detector, these treasonous charlatans have convinced those in positions of power in our government to trust them and their polygraph as the best option for security screening and internal investigations.  The trust placed in them and their insidious Orwellian instrument of torture is sadly misplaced.  The polygraph cartel has never caught even one spy – though many spies have passed the test easily while actively working for foreign governments and/or leaking classified information.  And to add insult to injury, they have called hundreds of thousands of truthful people liars and ruined their lives.  Most, if not all of these thugs involved in this multi-billion scam know they are perpetrating a massive fraud, but they don't give a damn as long as they can line their pockets with ill gotten gain.

[Wandersmann]

Most in the government are aware of its controversy, but until some other method of credibility assessment emerges on the horizon, none are going to advocate the abolition of the current process. The casualties of this process are perhaps lamented, but individuals are expendable.

Ark -  Quickfix is a clown who amuses me.  You, however, really make me angry.  If the world were only filled with people like you, we would still have slavery and the Berlin Wall.   Your self-righteous fence riding is despicable.  It's millions of jack-asses like you who unfortunately live here and enjoy US Citizenship you don't deserve that enables these polygraph clowns to thrive.  The anti-government East Germans that brought down that evil regime called people like you anpasser (those who go along with the system for self-gain)

There is a more efficient method of credibility assessment -  a good, old-fashioned background investigation.  It's worked for thousands of years. 

Here's another revelation ...... no matter what we do, we will always have traitors.  We have more traitors now than we did before the polygraph.  It's because our society is going down as our population soars with ignoramuses like you .  The polygraph hasn't caught one spy but has falsely condemned and ruined countless innocent people. 

When you say individuals are expendable, I don't know if you are serious or just being glib, but that concept is totally against everything our Constitution stands for and our founding fathers believed.  No country in history has ever held the value and rights of the individual more sacred than the United States. 

I pray to God and hope with all my heart that either you or someone very dear to you has your entire life ripped to pieces and ruined by this God damned polygraph, you self-righteous, self-serving POS.   

[Ex Member]

Sorry, but I don't think being asked to take a polygraph to obtain a job is some kind of sin against mankind. I am not a proponent, but I do not share your passion. Also, your ad hominem threats and insults are in violation of AP posting policy.

[John M.]

I don't think being asked to take a polygraph to obtain a job is some kind of sin against mankind

Being asked to take a polygraph and having unfavorable actions/decisions taken against you based solely on the "results" of the polygraph is most certainly a sin against mankind. As God is my witness.

Wishing bad things on someone is also very different than a threat.

[Doug Williams]

Sorry, but I don't think being asked to take a polygraph to obtain a job is some kind of sin against mankind. I am not a proponent, but I do not share your passion. Also, your ad hominem threats and insults are in violation of AP posting policy.

Arkhangelsk – I think if you were in John M's place and you had to take a polygraph test in order to get or keep a job you would have a much different attitude towards polygraph testing.  And if, like John M, you took that polygraph test and told the complete truth but you were called a liar and were fired from your job, your passion would be on par with his.

[Wandersmann]

Also, your ad hominem threats and insults are in violation of AP posting policy.

You are a piece of work.  I merely wished you a taste of your own medicine.   If you can twist my words into a threat you should be a polygraph examiner yourself.  Funny how you never complained about posting policy when Quickfix wished that Doug Williams suffer sodomy in prison.  Again, you are self-righteous, self serving individual.  Maybe the POS was a bit ad hominem, but I have no doubt it fits you to a tee.   

[Ex Member]

I think the issues the government has with you and John M have more to do with mental health than polygraphs.

Doug, I have had many kinds of job tragedies. I picked up and moved on. I did not recoil into some vicious victim posture attacking those whose viewpoints are diverse from my own.

I admire your staying power and wish you all the best in your crusade.

This forum has gone down hill since Doc's tragic accident. It is now the domain of a few with acute personality disorders.

So I will say goodbye to you all.

[Wandersmann]

So I will say goodbye to you all.

Thank you ... good-bye.  My comments and tone haven't changed since I joined.  The polygraph represents one of the worst abuses of U.S. Government authority in our nation's history and I am passionate that it must come to an end.  So anyone who argues with you must have mental health issues.  Talk about a victim.   

[John M.]

Might I remind you -

AntiPolygraph.org seeks the complete abolishment of polygraph "testing" from the American workplace. Now that the National Academy of Sciences has conducted an exhaustive study and found polygraph screening to be invalid, and even dangerous to national security, Congress should extend the protections of the 1988 Employee Polygraph Protection Act to all Americans.

You think this site has gone downhill?  Ha! I'd say it's about to become a relic.  There will be no need for it once we put an end to government sponsored use of the "truth machine".

Thousands and thousands of innocent people like myself have been unfairly judged by the polygraph and it's way past time for it to stop. 

If you can't see that, get the fuck out and take palyrider, quickfix and all the the other abusers with you.

I won't rest until congress passes the COMPREHENSIVE EMPLOYEE POLYGRAPH PROTECTION ACT.

For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.  Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand firm.  Stand therefore, having fastened on the belt of truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness.  Ephesians 6:12-1

[Wandersmann]

Well said John M.  Keep fighting the good fight.

[STOP POLYGRAPH ABUSE NOW]

Ex Members can't handle the truth.

[Administrator]

All are reminded of AntiPolygraph.org's posting policy:

AntiPolygraph.org prides itself on its commitment to free speech. All points of view are welcome here, including those of polygraph supporters. However, we ask that in posting, all involved remain civil. You agree, through your use of this message board, that you will not post any material which is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, or threatening. Any such posts may be removed to the Discarded Posts forum, and those making such posts may be banned. Such posts by repeat offenders may be deleted. Spam, flooding, advertisements, chain letters, pyramid schemes, and solicitations are also inappropriate. Such posts will be promptly deleted and those making them banned.

Name-calling and personal insults are inappropriate and do nothing to advance understanding. It's fine to attack arguments (with facts and reason), but not the character of the person making the argument.

Further posts to this message thread should address the original poster's inquiry.

[Wandersmann]

Name-calling and personal insults are inappropriate and do nothing to advance understanding. It's fine to attack arguments (with facts and reason), but not the character of the person making the argument.

Agreed, and my apologies for my occasional excesses in this regard.  I would like to remind the Administrator, however, that this site is the only refuge for polygraph victims who have suffered incredibly due to this polygraph hoax.  Polygraph victims, mostly American patriots who have sacrificed only to be betrayed by their government, have suffered suicide, depression, divorce, bankruptcy, etc, etc, solely due to this polygraph fraud.   To be further berated and insulted by the pro-polygraph crowd is often very hard to take.  I do take solace, however, knowing that the pro-polygraph crowd must know they are involved in a massive fraud and have some concern for the possible consequences.  Why else would they continue to follow this site? 

I realize that the administrator values the opinions of everyone who contributes to this site and this site belongs to the administrator.  I appreciate that I am able to post as a guest and do not take this privilege for granted.  I must admit, however, that I would love to see increasing postings from polygraph victims with details of abuse. 

I believe the end of polygraph abuse will only arrive when the number of victims and negative financial impact of polygraph abuse approaches the number of profiteers and profit derived from this fraud.  Those who have studied government should be familiar with the terms iron triangles and issue networks.  Our pluralist society is at its best when powerful lobbies exist on both sides of every issue to protect minority interests.  In this American tragedy the only powerful lobby is the pro-polygraph lobby.  Antipolygraph.org is the only voice that I am aware of that fights for the victims of the polygraph.  This site and it's allies needs to grow into a lobby capable of taking on the behemoth polygraph lobby.  We will never end this fraud but hopefully can improve the horrible suffering of the polygraph victims.   

[Andy Balmer]

Andy

Should we expect a chapter exploring how examiners use the uncertainties of law and science to manipulate subjects into truthful confession with wonderful results?

You certainly can! Quite literally in 'Ontological Uncertainty' and 'Polygraph Interrogation' chapters.