Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph (Read 98106 times)
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Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Nov 28th, 2001 at 4:22am
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My son took his first polygraph today.  Things did not go well and he was told that he "failed" the test.  I thought the purpose of the polygraph for a sex offender was to be sure the person was not offending anyone else and keep up with what other information they wish to extract from the person.  However, today's polygraph was totally focused by the person who administered the poly and the probation officer on the supposed "crime" my son is to have committed.  

They asked him question after question about what happened and told him that they thought he was a menace to society and a very bad person.  They laughed at him when he answered certain questions and told him he was lying.  He knows he told the truth about what happened.  We are in Texas and I fail to see the purpose in this test.  Apparently, it is one of the sex offender requirements, but why?  

To give you a short version of the whole story behind this, my son is on deferred adjudication probation for sexual assault.  He had been pursued for a month or so by a girl who apparently had a huge crush on him and was determined to persuade him to date her.  He did not respond to any of her advances until one night at a party with friends, she hounded him and hounded him until he unfortunately gave in to her rubbing and suggesting -- she tugged at his shirt and pants and made quite a spectable of herself.  He then made the mistake of having consensual sex with this 15 year-old girl who lied and told him she was 17.  He believed her because she is very mature and "well-developed" and besides, she worked someplace where you had to be 17 to work.  

Once he decided not to continue the relationship upon finding out she was only 15, she retaliated on him by telling her mom, who then went to the police.  Our attorney told us it was our best bet to take the DA's plea bargain, but in retrospect, I wish we had gone forward with a trial.  There is common knowledge in this girl's hometown that she is the town "slut" and I don't think my son should be paying the price for her lie.  My son has talked to several boys who have had sex with her and upon ending the relationship, the girl has pressed charges on other boys or has threatened them that she will do so.  

Please let me know if you are able to recommend a good criminal attorney specializing in these types of sex crimes who has successfully represented other boys in the same situation or who has on appeal been able to successfully alter the outcome.  Having to register as a sex offender for life or even the duration of the 7-year probation is too long and I get upset all over again realizing that my son's charges are similar or alike to those a child molester or pedophile receives.  Our laws need to be changed - there should be a difference in the eyes of the law of a boy who had sex with a consenting, VERY aggressive girl and a person who has a sickness and only gets turned on by children.  

What happened to the days when this crime had it's own label - statutory rape - now it is all indexed together under the label "sexual assault".  Sorry to go on and on, but as you can see, this really bothers me.  My son is devastated thinking that he will pay for this the rest of his life.  Any help anyone can provide will be much appreciated.  THANKS!  Cry
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #1 - Nov 28th, 2001 at 9:59am
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Worried Mom,

Spaces between paragraphs were added to your last post to facilitate ease of reading. No other changes were made.

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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #2 - Nov 28th, 2001 at 11:24am
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We are in Texas and I fail to see the purpose in this test.  Apparently, it is one of the sex offender requirements, but why?


Heavy lobbying by the polygraph community is one reason why mandatory sex offender testing is so widespread. When the Employee Polygraph Protection Act banished polygraphy from the private workplace in America in 1988, the entire private sector pre-employment polygraph industry (a cash cow for polygraphers) disappeared overnight. Polygraphers knew that they could not stay in business full-time with the limited amount of work available (essentially contract work screening applicants for police departments and other government employers) and began to plot other ways in which they could continue to perpetuate their institutionalized fraud.

It comes as no surprise to those familiar with polygraphy that the examiners chose to prey upon convicted sex offenders in the wake of being banished from plying their trade on a majority of Americans. As you will learn on this website, polygraph “tests” are actually interrogations that depend on trickery. Furthermore, abusive and unprofessional behavior seems to be the rule and not the exception among polygraphers. From the standpoint of a polygraph examiner, convicted sex-offenders, considered the “bottom feeders” of our society, are the perfect targets for a process known to give rise to frequent and substantial allegations of abuse. Examiners know that they can get away with things that the rest of society would not (and did not) tolerate. Numerous accounts of abusive behavior by polygraphers played a large part in the passing of the 1988 EPPA.

Although the number of “exams” being conducted is now far less, abusive and inappropriate behavior by polygraph examiners still continues unabated. The Personal Statements section of this website contains descriptive accounts of the abusive manner in which polygraphers treat applicants for employment with prestigious agencies including the FBI, US Secret Service, and CIA. Keep in mind that these are individuals with impeccable credentials who have already received a conditional job offer. Complaints against polygraphers almost always go nowhere, even when they are voiced by police officers, applicants for these positions, and others with spotless records (see the personal statements of Bill Roche).  I can only imagine how examiners treat convicted sex offenders. Considering the nearly insurmountable obstacles those with impeccable credentials face when attempting to advance a claim of misconduct against a polygrapher, I would assume that examiners who abuse convicted sex offenders sleep very well at night.

Back to your question. Essentially, the purpose of these “tests” is to keep polygraphers (many who possess only a high school diploma and an eight week training course as credentials) making $100-$300 per hour in a nation where polygraphy is all but otherwise banned. A secondary purpose of post-conviction sex offender polygraph programs is to allow legislators to appear tough on crime. Considering the wide misperception in our society that lie detectors are highly accurate (when in fact they have never been shown to operate at better than chance levels by a scientific study conducted under field conditions), one can understand why representatives support these laws. The purpose of this website is to educate both legislators and the general public about the true nature of polygraph “tests.”

Quote:
Please let me know if you are able to recommend a good criminal attorney specializing in these types of sex crimes who has successfully represented other boys in the same situation or who has on appeal been able to successfully alter the outcome.  Having to register as a sex offender for life or even the duration of the 7-year probation is too long and I get upset all over again realizing that my son's charges are similar or alike to those a child molester or pedophile receives.  Our laws need to be changed - there should be a difference in the eyes of the law of a boy who had sex with a consenting, VERY aggressive girl and a person who has a sickness and only gets turned on by children.  


Unfortunately, I know of no attorneys that deal with this particular situation. Perhaps others reading this board can help. I do agree with you that it is wrong that a teenager who engages in consensual intercourse with a girl a year or two younger is treated the same as a pedophile.  I have even heard (unconfirmed) reports of individuals arrested for public urination being classified as sex offenders. The catch-all term “sex offender” serves to dehumanize these individuals and thus increases societal support for programs of abusive punishment, including polygraph “tests.” I can only suggest that you write your representatives and tell them what has happened. Furthermore, I suggest that you consider writing letters to prominent US representatives encouraging them to pass a comprehensive polygraph protection act that protects all Americans.

Among other things, let your representatives know that you want to see polygraph “tests” stopped because they are easily beaten. Anyone, including convicted pedophiles can use countermeasures to pass a polygraph “test.” Countermeasures allow a pedophile who continues to engage in his repulsive behavior to easily beat the polygraph and divert suspicion onto other truthful subjects who are having trouble passing these unreliable “tests.”  I am as disgusted as anyone by child molesters. Nonetheless, the way to supervise them is with careful monitoring, not pseudoscientific tests that are easily defeated.
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #3 - Jan 7th, 2002 at 4:27am
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I understand your feelin's, we are trying to get custody of my husbands nephews and he was a victim as a child, then he had a conviction 8 yrs. ago, they made him take a polygraph to see if he may harm as an adult....

the examiner ran the test 3 times and told my husband that the test was inconclusive, so what is pass, fail and then this "inconclusive" ????? we need to gather this info. ASAP and do you know where we look or who to contact??

cowgirl

Cry
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #4 - Jan 23rd, 2002 at 5:39pm
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Dear Worried Mom,

I DO understand and sympathize with your son's situation as Texas does in fact have some really
screwey laws that make no sense.  Furthermore, it remains a sad fact that "entrapment" IS legal in the state of Texas whereas it is not in other states. 

I just recently completed my year long probation and deferred adjudication for a trumped up charge
of indencent exposure which was a total farce and bad reflection on the entire judicial system of
Texas.  I was in a park restroom minding my own business tending a nature call when a man came in,
groping himself trying to illicit a response from me which I chose to ignore.  He then later identified
himself as a cop, took identification information after his partner took my keys off my belt, and then let me go, saying I'd recieve a letter in ten days or so" and follow the instructions in the letter.  Such a letter was never recieved but an arrest warrant was entered in the system and when I later went to renew my
driver liscence, I was arrested.  The officer had written a trumped up report that was totaly untrue
along the line of "inappropriate sexual conduct" as if I were the one trying to illicit a response.  I found all this out when my attorney handled the case.  The point is, regardless of one's innocence, "the system"
will take the cop's side every time when they write their false trumped up reports as if thery were carved in stone.  My attorney and later on the "therapist" I had to see for a year both thought that the whole thing was absurd and the fact was that in order to get deferred adjudication and a year of supervised
probation, I was told that I was simply going to have to go before the judge and tell them what they wanted to hear, to accept responsibility for my actions, etc. etc. ad nauseam, take my lumps and
deal with it.  Later on, the polygraph thing seemed to be something that most attorneys, or at least
the one I had, were a little miffed by and had never heard of such a thing being done in such a
misdemeanor case when on probation.  Anyway, the polygraph exams were "inconclusive" and I already
knew that polygraphy is a fraud and depends on trickery and decpetion and so I simply employed
basic countermeasures to render the tests inconclusive.  To put it simply, just relax, control your breathing
slow, steady, and normal (whatever is normal to the individual), hear the questions but don't think about them, and keep a relaxing picture in you mind through the whole questioning process since recognizing the
the "control questions" can be difficult.  The first time I employed counter measures it caused me to
fail but the controling the breathing and sittinig very still and picturing a relaxing scene in the mind
works quite well.  While it neither pass nor fail, it really dosen't matter.  I think that you and your son
should have fought this and took it to trial and brought forward the other guys who have been
victimized by that vicious girl who obviously is the real criminal with serious problem.  BUT, if you've already
been given probation and all the bull crap it entails along with polygraphy and deferred adjudication,
all I can say is get through it, endure it, and before the probation expires, make certain that all the
probation fees are paid in full before the expiration date and be SURE to mail them certified with a return receipt and make copies of the made out money orders and then staple the return receipts to them for each month.  It is a screwey system separate from the the regular system of justice that has its own agenda
depending on the individual probation officer.  Most probation officers for "sex offenders" will almost always be women who, in some way or another, have it in for the male species and get off on doling out misery
in the truest sense of the term.  That is why they are in the business.  But when it comes to polygraphy,
if they were at the recieveing end of it, most of them would never "pass".

I also recommend that somehow by some means that this vicious girl who has cause this be somehow
trapped and all the other guys victimized by her come forward.  SHe needs to be beaten at her own
game, even if it is done so a little illegally.  What's good for the goose is good for the gander.  It
saddens and apalls me that your son has been victimized by a screwy judicial system that I can clearly
see needs an overhaul in Texas.  Write to your lawmakers and exercise your right to petition accompanied
by sample bills as this is really the process by which we can get laws changed or modified.  Just writing
to them is not enough.  But read the Texas Criminal Code and Procedures beforehand so that you
will be well armed with what aspect of definition in it that needs to be changed.  Again I sympathize
with you and your son.  It is an injustice that defies all logic and reason as this vicious gal is probably
victimizing other guys as well.  Sooner or later she will end up paying a heavy price for her conduct
as she obviuosly has a problem.
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #5 - Feb 7th, 2002 at 3:24am
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Join the club -- I really feel for you and your son.

Unfortunately, people that are accused of these types of crimes have become the scapegoats of society -- kind of the modern-day version of the Salem Witch Trials.  The threat and sheer terror of the ramifications resulting from the slim chance of felony Sex Assault conviction serve to intimidate just about everyone into taking a plea whose consenquences may be severe but are less than years in prison as a sex-offendor and lifetime probation and "therapy".

Now add the intimdation of the ploygraph and it becomes almost unbearable.   Did you know that some states are even toying with the idea of putting "convicted" sex offendors on the internet?

  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #6 - Feb 10th, 2002 at 8:01pm
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The idea of putting "sex offenders" on the internet is nothing new and it IS already being done in
Texas along with other "scarlet lettering" tactics that serve no real function than to stroke the egos
of those who get off on badgering and intimidating people accused of "sex offender" crimes.
When I was on probation for a trumped up charge of indecent exposure, I was told by the probation
officer that if I got a second offence, that I'd have to register on the national sex offender registry
on the internet.  This same probation officer had posted within the office a large poster with the
news headline and article of a judge in Texas who proceeds forward like a Puritan in Plymouth by
scarlet lettering convicted offenders in the form of having to post a large sign on their property
that reads in big bold letters, "CONVICTED SEX OFFENDER LIVES HERE---REPORT ALL SUSPICIOUS
BEHAVIOR TO......(phone number).  The article showed a convict holding the sign which he was told
had to be posted on his property and clearly visible and to remove it would result in his immediate
arrest and revocation of probation as this scarlet lettering is part of his terms of probation.
How a judge can get away with such a thing is beyond me but if figures in a place like Texas.

Don't get me wrong,  I'm all for the proper adjudication of severe felony sex offenders, especially child
molester pedophiles but at the same time I'm knowledgable of the fact that they have a problem and  need professional help as most of them were molested themselves as children.  To just outright throw them
in jail without at least trying to properly therapeutically correct them into rightness is neither ethical
nor just in any sense of the term.  The judicial system, especially that of Texas, seems to want to
push the envelope for "therapy" and "reform" in lieu of jail but negate the beneficial effects of
"treatment" by such practices as the above described scarlet lettering and of course, polygraph testing.
To simply outright just court order branding them in this manner is neither therapeutic nor logical, for that matter, if one is to expect proper reform from criminal child molesting behavior.  To make spectacles of them
to the rest of sociaty will only negate their reform because the results of such scarlet lettering will only make the rest of society cling to the mindset that they are beyond reform.  I'm certain that there are some
convicted sex offenders, some repeat offenders, who, for whatever reasons either can't or simply won't
rehabilitate and should be taken off the streets and confined in the cases where there are repeat offences.
It is at that point obvious that they won't reform.  BUT all possibilities of reform are negated by scarlet lettering along with the bull crap of polygraphy added to it.  With these things combined, how can anyone possibly expect that the convict would even be capable of reform when, by conformance to all the terms of probation, the rest of society continues to treat them with no respect and no encouragement towards a positive end?  Is this real justice or simply the meanderings of an overblown ego armed with a gavel for the sake of politics and re-election?

Grant it, we need change and reform in the definitions within the laws of Texas as well as more legitimate
and positive therapies for "sex offenders", NOT scarlet lettering at the hands of judges with overblown egos.
Since polygraphs are technically no longer legal in court, I fail to understand how it is that a pseudo science like polygraphy is employed by a legal a system that outlawed it in the private sector yet continues to use
it in a way for political reasons, knowing all the while that is is a scam and has no real basis in science nor is really reliable.  While it remains rare that judges themselves order polygraph testing, the fact that probation
system uses it is as apalling as them once having been admissable in court.  It seems to be a double standard that the very thing that was outlawed in the private sector is employed by the probation system
who are empowered by judges to do as they wish, "it then being admissable in court",  all based on the opinions and recommendations of an egotistical probation officer, many of whom have the attitude of,
"So the judge didn't send you to jail, well, I'll do everything in my power to get you there, legitimately
or otherwise."  It is this mentality among probation officers that is more apalling than judges who practice
scarlet lettering and negate the potential successes of positive therapy towards successful reform of sex offenders. 

It is not just sex offenders who are polygraphed.  I've learned that in Texas, ALL probationers
are subject to the abusiveness of polygraphy at the discretion of probation officers who, based on the
criteria and guidelines that vary from county to county in Texas, can and will employ the scam of polygraphy, all the while telling you that it (the polygraph) is admissable in court when what they really mean is that THEIR opinion and recommendations, along with the opinions of the "therapist", based on the meandering results of polygraphy, are what are really admissable in court.  Since the courts of Texas usually
DO NOT order polygraph exams because of legal structure, it remains a mystery how it is that if the court did not order it as terms of probation, that the probation system, with its own agenda can get away with it legally. In my own case I had to pay for the damn poly exams in addition to my monthly probation fees as well as having to pay a portion to the therapist.  This sort of thing varies from county to county in Texas.
I had transferred my probation from one county to another with the original county in which probation was rendered as having jurisdiction throughout the entire probation period.  Had I remained in the original county
and not transferred, I'd have paid the full $60.00 per session therapist fee every week for a year as well as having to pay for two of the three poly exams I had to endure.  To address the abusiveness of polygraphy,
my first poly was a "come clean" sort of exam in which the polygrapher, arrogant smart assed, inappropriate
tone of voice asshole that he was, went over a copy of the original trumped up police report conducive to my case to devise his questions.  I had already paid the $200.00 and recieved the receipt, he devised his questions and basically badgered me into signing a written confession of "what happened" but only so long as it was in accordance and conformity to the cops version of the occurence.  He never even hooked the damn polygraph up to my body and basically just ripped me off!!!  Then I'm certain that he never told the probation officer what really happened.  If only I could have been armed with a recording device and tiney video camera!!!  I later learned that this examiner was dismissed and no longer employed by Richard Wood &
Associates of Arlington, Texas, the polygraph firm that most north Texas counties utilize.

As far as employing countermeasures to "pass", it remains to be seen that they are really effective and are only so effective ONLY if one can recognize the control questions.  Now that they have made that difficult,
the best countermeasures I've learned is simply to take the polygrapher's instructions one step further when
they tell you, sit back relax, breathe normally, and sit very still through the process. Just control your breathing by having taken a couple deep breaths before the actual test begins.  Since you'll already know what the questions are and your responses to them, don't think about the questions as they are presented in the test and simply keep a firm image of something relaxing and tranquil in your mind as you answr the questions.  Hear the questions but don't think about them as "thinking" will render a physiological response whereby which the polygrapher can say that you're lieing.  This kind of control renders the graph even an consistent on every question giving the polygrapher nothing to compare to and thus your results will be inconclusive.  While such is neigher pass nor fail, wether you pass of fail really dosen't matter as the probation officer's mind is usually made up one way or the other near the end of one's probation.  While they will lead you to believe that it is admissable in court, it is really their recommendations along with any other arrests during the probation period that determine wether or not the judge will extend it.  As long as one has adherred to all the terms of probation as specified in the probationer's pink copy of the court
documents and their are no arrests during the period and all probation fees are paid, then usually they will not extend one's probation.  On the other hand, if one gets the probation officer from hell like I had, you'd better do whatever it takes to keep these people happy because apparently the courts and judges have no
better sense of legal competency than to render judicial decisions based on their own moods of the moment
along with the moods and egotistical motives of probation officers, some of whom's sole mission in the business is to cause you to go to jail simply because the judge didn't put you there from the start.  This is especially true in the case of "sex offenders" and in Texas, a whole host of "offences" are grouped together under one heading, the chargings of which will stick based solely on the meanderings of perverted law enforcement officers who, like many probation officers, get off on doling out misery and INJUSTICE, knowing all the while that their own actions in the process are outright wrong but will get away with it because of the flaws in the laws, coupled witht the fact that "the system" will take their sides every time, regardless of the fact that entrapment tactics were used but such is never reflected in the trumped up reports they submit to make a case against anyone.  This is where the legal and judicial structures of Texas are badly in need of an overhaul because to simply group a list of "offences" under one heading without proper definition then leaves a wide open margin for not only law enforcement, but the system  as a whole to get away with ruining decent individuals all for the sake of ego stroking, politics, and re-election of judges who, unlike in the old days, apparently can't render a proper judicial decision without it all having been pre-decided by individuals with overblown egos and an incessant drive for doling out misery to make themselves feel good.

This seems to be the case in Texas too much so and if it is to ever change, people must make an effort to
contact their legislators and congressmen with petitions and sample bills towards getting the laws changed
as well as proper definition and catagorization of "sex offences", NOT grouping it all together under one heading without consideration of mitigating cricumstances, as in the case of "Worried Mom" here in this forum and her son who obviously is the victim of the real crime that, because of the flaws in the law and the system, is now the real victim while the real criminal goes unpunished as a result of screwey loosely defined laws.  All I can say at this point is STAND UP, SPEAK OUT WITH ACTIVISM AND MAKE AN EFFORT
TO GET OUR LAWMAKERS TO CHANGE WHAT MUST BE CHANGED in a way that is going to truly make a difference and STOP all this madness.  BUT we live in a society that embraces a judicial system that
the common man is led to believe is far better than any other, forgetting that it is they who helped create
it along with its flaws because it is an imperfect system devised and implemented by humans and human
fallabilities, the epitome of which can be corrected by due process of law and adherence to that which is legitimate, NOT PSEUDO-SCIENCE, NOT SCARLET LETTERING OF THE OFFENDER and to embrace such things
as "justice" is the greatest injustice of all.  The rights of the individual WILL be protected, only so long as they don't conflict with the political agendas of the state and nothing is more dangerous to any society
that professes to embrace "DEMOCRACY".
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #7 - Feb 21st, 2002 at 5:21am
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Texas is not the only state with mandatory lie detector tests.  It is done in Kansas too.  My fiance is stitting in county jail tonight because he failed his mandatory test.  He is like your son had sex with a consensual sex with a 15 year old girl and went to prison for 4 years for it.  He is now on parole and they are going to put on severe restrictions and maybe sent him back if he does not pass his next test in March.  Sex offenders are all lumped into one category with molestors and rapists.  His name and picture is on the internet also.  If there is any way to help him pass his next test I would like to know it, he has done nothing wrong and told them only the truth but they say he is lying and manipulating them.  It is not fair the way the system treats them but what can you do?   Kansas
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #8 - Feb 21st, 2002 at 9:37am
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Quote:
If there is any way to help him pass his next test I would like to know it, he has done nothing wrong and told them only the truth but they say he is lying and manipulating them....


See Chapters 3 & 4 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector to learn about the trickery on which these "tests" rely and how to pass them.
  

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if you would like to REALLY help
Reply #9 - Feb 23rd, 2002 at 8:23pm
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Whether you are (1) a parent or other relative of a boy or "young man" (2) that boy or "young man" who is subject to the registration requirements or (3) just a person who is appalled by the disabilities and/or discrimination that can result from having to register, please read this.  In particular, I am referring to boys and young men who receive probation or have been incarcerated as a result of having sex with a minor - what was previously known as "statutory rape" wherein the sex with the girl was consensual - but which is being treated in the State of Texas the same as being a pedophile or child molester, etc.  In my eyes, there is a big difference in being a pedophile/child molester/true sex "offender" and being a boy who has consensual sex with a girl who is under age. Unfortunately, the State of Texas seems to think that these offenses should all be labeled and punished the same and that is simply unjust.  By no means do I condone what is done to children/boys/girls by persons who truly have an illness, mental sickness or other perversion - that is a separate atrocity and should be dealt with harshly.  I received a communication from another concerned Texas parent and it has to do with constitutionality of Texas' sex offender registration.  An assistant public defender in Wichita County named Tony Odiorne is very concerned about Texas' current registration requirements, and he is trying to do something about it - he is scheduled to go to Austin on Monday so if you have any information that will assist him, please feel free to email him.  The details of his "mission" are as follows:

"My name is Tony Odiorne and I am an assistant public defender in  Wichita County.  My job is to represent persons accused of crimes who cannot afford to hire an attorney.  A number of persons I represent are accused of sexual offenses or failing to register as a sex offender.

In conjunction with my practice, I am scheduled to travel to Austin next week to argue the constitutionality of Texas' sex offender registration program in front of the Court of Criminal Appeals.  Key portions of my argument are that persons required to register do indeed suffer disabilities (including difficulty in obtaining employment, housing and possible physical harm to themselves, family members or their property from others in their community who do not want them there), and that there is no provision to restrict or eliminate the registration and notification requirements for those who no longer pose a risk.

As you are probably well aware, things in Texas have generally gotten worse every legislative session for persons accused of sexual offenses.  The one bright spot in last year's session was the opportunity for juvenile sex offenders to be exempt from registration (in very limited situations).  However, while every state has registration requirements, most are not as bad as Texas' and those that were have usually had some court-imposed limitations put upon them due to legal challenges in their state.

I hope to convince the Court to declare some or all of Texas' statute unconstitutional, or at least restrict the dissemination of some of the registration information to protect people from reprisals.  If you have any information that may be of assistance to me, I would be most grateful.

Sincerely,
Anthony C. Odiorne
Assistant Public Defender
Wichita County
email:  anthony.odiorne@co.wichita.tx.us"
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #10 - Jul 16th, 2002 at 1:23pm
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I am a registered sex offender in Texas.  I am on 10 years of deferred adjudication probation for 2 counts of felony sexual assault of a minor.  My victim was just a month shy of 15, and I was 36.  I am a female. The sexual relationship lasted about 6 weeks, and altho he was a minor, it was consensual. 

I am required to take an annual polygraph.  Last July I took my first one, passed, no problems, no stress.  Saturday I took my 2nd poly.  I was confident that I would pass...I have strived to do my probation perfectly.  I am not an evil person, I never intended harm, and I have worked hard at therapy to discover what it was inside of me that made me believe that a sexual relationship with a teen was acceptable.

I failed the poly.  I just read over the book recommended here and it was classic poly techniques.  I answered every question honestly, except the question he told me to lie about...which was "Have you ever lied to someone who trusted you?"  He said I failed every question, even one about have I had sex with animals.  Then came the interrogation.  He started TELLING  me I was lying about something, that my body was betraying me, and I needed to give it up.   He called in my probation officer and together they started grilling me on my masturbation fantasies.  It was very traumatic and embarrassing.  I suffer from severe anxiety and panic attacks and their technique brought on some severe symptoms, which I am sure just reinforced them thinking I was guilty. 

The whole test was uncomfortable physically.  I am a big woman, and the bp cuff was too tight.  I didn't complain.  By the time the questioner got to the relevant questions I was in extreme pain and my arm was twitching.  My fingers turned blue. 

I meet with my probation officer and therapist next week.  I don't know what to say when I see them.
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #11 - Jul 16th, 2002 at 4:34pm
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Dear justagurl,

Even though it is illegal to record a conversation in the state of Texas without the other party having knowledge, there are still devices you can get at spy supply places that are inconspicuous and work quite well.  I suggest that you record your meetings with your probation officer as well as your poly exams
as I did.  It may not be usable in any legal proceeding but at least it will give your attorney something to work with that shows your truthfullness to him or her whereby he or she will be better able to defend you in the event of a legal proceeding.  All I can say is endure it and the b/s that comes with it.  This is Texas,
the land of b/s when it comes to legal stuff.

I know what I went through with my poly exams and the first one, failed by the way because the b/p
cuff was too tight, was the poly examiners first method of deliberately proceeding in a manner that would, simply by the cuff being too tight, create enough tension to cause you to fail.  Because I recorded this session, had I had to have a legal proceeding, at least my attorney would have been informed of the reality of the situation and the fact that it was the polygrapher who caused the failing by a cuff too tight that,
when presented to a judge, would have created enough reasonable doubt in his or her mind to issue
special orders as an addendum to your terms of probation.  IF such a thing is done as it can be and is on occasion, them the bullying probation officers have no choice but to comply and if they don't, they end up in deep ca ca.

My advice to you is simply follow the polygraphers instructions which is usually, sit up straight but not
rigid, look straight ahead, relax, and answers the questions yes or no.  If you take several DEEP breaths
before the "test" begins and just simply relax and breathe slowly and normally (whatever is normal for
you), and keep firmly in your mind a relaxing image such as relaxing on the beach or something,
hear the questions but don't think about them ( since by then you'll already know what the answers are going to be), you'll come up with "inconclusive" results.  While that is neither pass nor fail, inconclusive
results are exactly that, INCONCLUSIVE and therefore nothing can be made of it since what they really base everything on is the recommendations of your therapist who "teams" with your probation officer as to wether a probation extension should be recommended.  As long as you adhere to all your terms of probation
and pay all of your fees and go to your therapy sessions, in most cases, unless you're a repeat offender,
they won't extend it.  Just pay all your fees, early if possible, send them certified mail with a return receipt,
and make copies of the made out money orders and attach the return receipt to that copy for each month.
It a a screwy system in Texas and mistakes are made often by idiot ethnic clerks more interested in tending their nails than posting probation fees to the proper account and having a certified mail return receipt,
which is an original legal document like a cancelled check is the only legal recourse you have if they later come back and say that you haven't payed all your fees.  Any good competent attorney wil tell you this
as it is the only proof you have of payment made other than a receipt issued by the clerk if you pay your fees in person.  I strongly advise that you pay off all your fees just before your probation ends.  You'll
recieve a letter near the end of it with a statement as to wether you are all paid up or still owe some.  BUT
usually by then, and I can't emphasize this enough, have them all paid off BEFORE your probation end date
because one little ding and they will use it as an excuse to extend the probation, regardless of the "recommendations" of your therapist and probation officer.  Some counties in Texas will let you pay off all your fees ahead of time and some won't as every county is different, hence the inconsisitencies of "the system" in Texas.  If you can pay them all off early do each one with a separate money order for each month, all sent certified.  I know it is an inconvenience and costs but it is better to have legal recourse
on your side than to be left hanging if an error is made, you paid everything, and then the system comes back and says you haven't.  I've seen this before and it can be a real legal mess with it being a case of you
and your attorney's word against theirs without any documentation.

As far as polys, do as I've suggested above with breathing control, relaxation, and imaging and you will do fine. Secretly record the sessions if you can and DON"T take any unnecessary "ABUSIVENESS" from the polygrapher and if they do get abusive, DEMAND ANOTHER EXAMINER.  Also, one more thing.  IF you want to avoid the polys altogether, get pregnant. THEY WILL NOT poly exam a pregnant woman as "it can be stressful", as they put it and if it would even remotely stressfully affect the preganant subject, as they know it would, then THEY would be held liable if any complication occurred.  I saw this first hand when I had to go and take my polys when a pregnant woman was scheduled for and exam and the polygrapher rejected the subject and was on the phone immediately to the requester of the poly to inform him or her that they WOULD NOT proceed with the exam, period. The rest of the b/s you will just have to endure through the duration of your probatioin period.  I had two inconclusives by employing the relaxation and breath control techniques and because of it, they had nothing to use against me.  They key thing is to not volunteer any information to the polygrapher.  The other thing is that when you go in and prior to the test beginning, you sign a release form that releases them of any liability and wether or not you consent to your TEST being
available, statistically for other polygraphers and the Polygraph Association.  Check the do not consent.
They won't proceed with the test if you refuse to sign the waiver but because you are on probation, you really can't get out of signing it.  Just don't check the consent to release the information to anyone other than your probation officer.  They will tell you that that information never gets out to third parties but the fact is, regardless of what they tell you, any information you volunteer, rest assured they are telling your probation officer even though the probation officer and they will tell you that the polygrapher only tells wether you "pass" or "fail".  This is the biggest lie of all because they DO tell everything you volunteer to your probation officer.  All in all, though, if you're pregnant, they won't test you at all and your probation officer knows this, though they won't admit it and you have to go through with the attempt at keeping the appointment on the appointed day only to be rejected by the polygrapher, after which there is nothing
your probation officer can do about it no matter how much he or she wants you to be poly examined. So you do have an advantage as a female IF you're willing to go that far to lessen the b/s that you have to go through with polygraph tests.  In north Texas counties the probation system usually uses Richard Wood and Associates of Arlington, TX for all their b/s polygraphy schinanigans.  When I had to endure them, they had one polygrapher, my first one, who was a real bastard and I later found out from my therapist that this particular examiner had been dismissed.  The rest of them there are relatively nice although clearly backwoods redneckish and not exactly very highly educated which anyone with any intellect can clearly see.  They may talk a good game but as with most of the advice in this forum, don't fall for their b/s which is clearly recognizable, don't volunteer any personal information, don't lie when the poly examiner tells you to as the questions he will tell you to "lie" on are designed to trip you up and is their warped way of creating a control question that really isn't in compliance with the guidelines that they are supposed to follow.  The truth is, it really dosen't matter wether you pass or fail because in either case, you're screwed.  IF you pass, you're probation officer and possibly therapist will badger you and say you're lying or holding something back.  IF you fail then they will really badger you.  If you have consistent results of inconclusive, since it is those idiots who work for "the system" who give credence to polygraphs, if you're inconclusive, then they have nothing to use against you, despite the fact that THEY already know that polygraphy is B/S!!  If they were on the recieving end of the exams, they'd all FAIL MISERABLY no matter how much they insist they were truthful, just like their probationer victims.  I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors.
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #12 - Aug 28th, 2002 at 5:45am
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Your son is a sex offender.
What he has convinced you about his crime is typical thinking for sex offenders.  They are the victims, not the person they hurt.  It is sad that you buy into his minimizations so easily.  Now you will not be able to help him change his deviant thoughts and behaviors, because now you support his deviant thinking patterns.
Whether the polygraph works or not, it does one thing that helps sex offenders like your son.  It makes them re-evaluate the truth about what they did.  Habitual lies are a daily part of a sex offenders life.  Using the polygraph to force them into the truth is the best thing that can happen for a sex offender's road to self-realization and the changing of their deviant thoughts.
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #13 - Aug 28th, 2002 at 7:22am
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Mr. Psychology,

You write:

Quote:
...Whether the polygraph works or not, it does one thing that helps sex offenders like your son....  Using the polygraph to force them into the truth is the best thing that can happen...


That fact that the polygraph (polygraph screening and particularly polygraph screening of those convicted of sex crimes) does not work, contrary to what you state, does mean EVERYTHING.  The devil is most assuredly in the details.   If it has no validity as a diagnostic tool, it only adds to the victimization of the sex crime victim and, in fact, exists largely because the polygraph community has unscrupulously created a new business market by taking advantage of the legitimate fears of the(se) original victim(s).  The only thing the polygraph forces an examinee into is a combination of comedy, error, and tragedy.  Polygraph examinations dealing with the inflammatory details of imagined prurient sexual activity presented in the form of a fishing expedition to an examinee hardly forces anyone to confront the truth.  The truth that badly needs to be confronted (by you) is that polygraph screening (and particularly programs dealing with convicted sex offenders) is completely invalid.
  
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Re: Texas sex offender & mandatory polygraph
Reply #14 - Aug 28th, 2002 at 2:51pm
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Quote:
Your son is a sex offender.
What he has convinced you about his crime is typical thinking for sex offenders.  They are the victims, not the person they hurt.  It is sad that you buy into his minimizations so easily.  Now you will not be able to help him change his deviant thoughts and behaviors, because now you support his deviant thinking patterns.
Whether the polygraph works or not, it does one thing that helps sex offenders like your son.  It makes them re-evaluate the truth about what they did.  Habitual lies are a daily part of a sex offenders life.  Using the polygraph to force them into the truth is the best thing that can happen for a sex offender's road to self-realization and the changing of their deviant thoughts.


Wow, all this amazing insight without benefit of actually having met the person, nor knowing any facts other than those put forth here. While your general comments about sex offenders as a whole no doubt mostly hold true, the fact that you so casually disregard the facts as they are told here, and instead rely upon your knee-jerk SOTP pamphlet and also cling valiantly to a worthless diagnostic tool like polygraphy should worry everyone, myself included.
  

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