This is for EVERYONE who is AGAINST POLYGRAPHS

[Fair Chance]

Dear Mercible,

I have often mentioned the pre-screening use of polygraph without any specific incident knowledge or testing as a 50/50 coin toss.  The NAS did specify that specific incident polygraph testing was far better than chance but far from perfect.

The NAS was very critical in the current usage of polygraph in pre-screening employment with no specific incident known or researched.  They did say that such usage was far from perfect and not much above a 50/50 coin toss.

I am probably one of the most realistic posters here who has consistantly admitted that the government has only tried to increase polygraph usage in pre-employment since the NAS study.

The FBI pre-screening polygraph was given in my case, prior to any background information being gathered.  There was no specific incident information available to even be questioned.  Roughly 50% of all FBI applicants who make it to the polygraph phase are disqualified on the polygraph alone with no background check.  If you see me quote the 50/50 coin toss, I am relating it to the polygraph pre-prescreening exam as the FBI uses it.

Regards.

[Mercible]

Thanks for the clarification.  

[George W. Maschke]

50% of applicants for the FBI are disqualified by polygraph?  I believe that about 50% of applicants are disqualifed because of indescresions in their backgrounds, not on the basis of polygraph only.  These figures are being pulled out of thin air, not being researched totally....

The 50% FBI polygraph failure rate is pulled not from thin air, but from the mouths of senior FBI officials who are in a position to know. See FBI Polygraph Failure Rate Reportedly Near 50%.

[polyfool]

50% of applicants for the FBI are disqualified by polygraph?  I believe that about 50% of applicants are disqualifed because of indescresions in their backgrounds, not on the basis of polygraph only.  These figures are being pulled out of thin air, not being researched totally.  Yes people are diqualifed from law enforcement jobs based on polygraph findings, however the polygraph findings are not the only reason for the disqualification in all cases.  

Dark Cobra:

The FBI doesn't conduct background investigations until the applicant passes a polygraph. Half of FBI applicants who receive conditional job offers don't receive official hire dates, that's why the FBI extends offers to two applicants for every job opening--primary and alternate-- AND THE JOB MAY STILL GO UNFILLED.

If the agency doesn't give the go ahead for the background until the applicant passes the poly, then it would seem quite feasible based on the FBI's on hiring practices, that indeed, 50 percent are being disqualified based on the poly alone. The FBI admits to a 20 percent failure rate. The agency should be ashamed to screen applicants using a procedure with a 20 percent failure rate--that's atrocious. It's obvious there's a problem with poly screening, as you wouldn't expect 20 percent of the "best and the brightest" to be drug addicts and dope peddlers. It's complete nonsense. Whether it's 20 or 50 percent, either one is unacceptable.

[polyfool]

My only comment would be, there is no "research" that indicates 50% are disqualifed by polygraph.  There may be a Computer Criminal History check or a Computer Credit Check and some may be disqualifed prior to a polygraph.  I don't know, so I may really be in error here, it just does not sound correct to me that 50% fail polygraph examinations.  I may just be ignorant and if so please forgive.  

I would agree there is no research that indicates the percentage of FBI applicants who fail the poly, but there should be, it's obviously a problem. I don't know what kind of checks the FBI conducts on applicants before the poly or if all of that is done afterwards, assuming of course, the applicant passes? I would think it would at least look at the background forms the applicant fills out for any possible problems before the applicant is extended a conditonal job offer--at least that was the case for me.

[George W. Maschke]

Polyfool,

The 20% FBI pre-employment polygraph failure rate dates back to 1997, and is documented in a letter by then Laboratory Division director Donald M. Kerr. This letter may be reviewed in HTML and PDF formats, respectively, here:

http://antipolygraph.org/hearings/senate-judiciary-1997/kerr-letter.shtml

http://antipolygraph.org/hearings/senate-judiciary-1997/kerr-letter.pdf

Post 9-11, it seems clear that the failure rate increased dramatically. As I mentioned earlier, the 50% figure is taken from on-the-record remarks by senior FBI officials. DarkCobra2005 chooses to disbelieve these officials because the FBI hasn't published any "research" on its polygraph failure rate. But I don't see any compelling reason to discount their word, as they were in positions to know and had little conceivable motive to lie. Moreover, "research" is not required to calculate an agency's polygraph failure rate: it's an elementary school-level math problem.

[polyfool]

George,

Thanks for the clarification.

[George W. Maschke]

DarkCobra2005,

Links to, and excerpts from, the relevant articles are provided in the first two posts of the message thread, FBI Polygraph Failure Rate Reportedly Near 50%.