Dr. Phil Lie Detector Series, 6-7 & 28 Nov. 2006

[furedy]

Polygnov06reply

SPECIAL PERILS TO INNOCENT SUSPECTS IN CHILD SEX ABUSE CASES

In these cases with which Dr. Phil is dealing, there is a special danger because the relevant questions arouse much greater emotion in the innocent than those pertaining to other less disgusting crimes such as theft and even murder.  So the relevant questions about child sex abuse by Dr. Phil and his fellow entrails-reading polygraphers must have aroused considerably more emotion in innocent suspects than the "standard" so-called "control" questions like "did you ever do anything you were ashamed of in your life".  You don't need a PhD in psychology or psychophysiology, or even a high-school degree, to understand, by an exercise in common sense, that an innocent suspect would give a bigger response to such relevant questions than to control questions.

It's interesting that 29 tears ago a criminal lawyer and I made the same point (http://www.psych.utoronto.ca/~furedy/Papers/ld/Cconfess.doc).  The relevant passage from that paper is pasted below:

Another mitigating condition arises when the "control" questions, which are meant to generate as much emotion (even in the innocent) as do the relevant questions, patently would not have done so. One such "control" question that the polygrapher generated in the Middleton case, was "Did you ever lie to someone in authority?". It surely strains the bounds of credulity to suppose that, even in the innocent, the amount of emotion generated by this question would compare to that generated by the relevant question ("Did you lick X's vagina", when X was 4 years old?). Even the staunchest defender of the general accuracy of CQT polygraphy would admit that, even for the innocent, the relevant question is much more emotive than the "control" question, and that, in this case, the polygrapher did not come up with an adequate "control" question.


      It's even more significant that 20 years on, Dr. Phil and his polygraphers are using the same "control" question, although now the few psychophysiologists who support the CQT polygraph, are using the (meaningless) term "comparison" question.  This, perhaps, is the clearest demonstration that the CQT polygraph.  This, perhaps, is the clearest way to distinguish science and science-based applications from pseudo science and the snake-oil-type applications that are based no that pseudo science.

      A science revises it terms and concepts in the light of the evidence, and the technologies associated with that science gradually improve in their accuracy.  That's how we got from the 20 feet flown by the Wright brothers to the flight to the moon.  In contrast, a pseudo-science and snake-oil technology based on that pseudo science revises its terminology in a rhetorical attempt to mislead the public, and, like entrails reading, produces no real but only illusory improvements in its accuracy.  It also helps, of course, when an articulate and formally educated figure like Dr. Phil espouses this peculiarly American flight of technological fancy that continues to reap havoc in North American society, as well as weakening its national securitiy.

All the best, John

[ecchasta]

I read the last reply.  It is quite good and reasonable.  I want to "correct" one thing you said.  It was:

".... the polygrapher did not come up with an adequate 'control' question."

This statement (it seems to me) implies that there might be such a thing as an "adequate  control question".  There can never be an adequate control question because polygraphic lie detection is as you say "snake oil", not capable of detecting lies.

Later

[justagurlinseattle]

In regards to this question posted earlier,

"I was just wondering... I heard that a polygraph should not be preformed on a person who is on medication.... or who has ADD or ADHD... Is this true?"

The answer... A person on medication or with ADHA should not be given a polygraph.  And neither should a people who are not on medication and are perfectly normal.

Polygraphs do not detect lies on anyone!  Polygraphy is an interrogation tool just like lying to a suspect is an interrogation tool that occasionally leads to confessions.  Don't be head-faked.

I understand all of that.. and I personally DON'T believe in polygraph...
It is total BS....

I was wondering though.... if there are criteria of people who do believe in it... and try to pass it off....

such as not doing a polygraph when someone is pregnant.....

I thought I had heard once that an ADHD person would not be a good canidate for polygraph....
(and I know... NOBODY IS A GOOD CANIDATE)

 

[furedy]

REPLIES TO JOCHAASTA AND JUSTAGIRL

jOCCHASTA.

        The statement about the "inadequacy" of the "control" was in the context of defending (successfully) an individual in a legal context where, even in polyraphic terms, the "control" question was inadequate because there was no attemmpt to make it have anywhere near the emotional impact of the relevant question for an innocent person.  In general terms, as I've emphasised in many papers and a book, no polykgraphic "control" is adequate, because it is not a control in the normal scientific sense of control.

        JUSTAGURL;

          It's sensible to ask whether a science-based, specifiable and standardized test is affect by such factors, but does not make sense even to raise such questions for an unstandardized interrogatory interveiw like the CQT polygraph, except that perhaps a person with a disability may be more subject to post-test interrogatory pressures than one without a disability.  Still, in most criminal contexts, especiallyk those involving child sex abuse, by the time someone gets into the clutches of a polygrapher, that person is likely to be unbalanced because of the terrible presures he is under.

All the best, John

[paris]

I've never thought much of lie detector "tests", but now after reading ;your posts i realize how bogus they are indeed!

It is shameful for Dr. Phil, who must know better, to try to fool the american audience, and worse yet, to create such a witch hunt with virtually no evidence of foul play.

I guess you can see how someone like Hitler could come to power, with use of pseudo-science, control of the media, and a very dynamic personality.....

[David Lynch]

Jeremy was arrested for possession of child pornography.  You're a moron if you think he's innocent.  You're also pretty dumb when it comes to lie detectors.  Seems the only people complaining about lie detectors are lowlife child molesters like the dirtbags you support so firmly.

[T.M. Cullen]

Jeremy was arrested for possession of child pornography.  You're a moron if you think he's innocent.  You're also pretty dumb when it comes to lie detectors.  Seems the only people complaining about lie detectors are lowlife child molesters like the dirtbags you support so firmly.

Good post!  Very edifying, and timely too.  

He was arrested for possession of child porn?  Well, he must be guilty then.  That is quite obvious.  If it was on Dr. Phil it must be true, though one should probably wait for verification from the Enquirer!

Pardon the sarcasm

TC, idiot moron

[George W. Maschke]

Jeremy was arrested for possession of child pornography.  You're a moron if you think he's innocent.  You're also pretty dumb when it comes to lie detectors.  Seems the only people complaining about lie detectors are lowlife child molesters like the dirtbags you support so firmly.

Hi, David, and welcome to the AntiPolygraph.org message board. Am I correct in inferring that you are the David Lynch who assisted with the HelpKaylee.com website? I appreciate your concern for Kaylee. But you're mistaken about lie detectors.

I don't know whether Jeremy Park sexually molested his daughter. But I do know that polygraph chart readings offer no answers in this regard. As you will recall (and has been discussed earlier in this message thread), while Park failed the polygraph administered by Dr. Phil's hired polygrapher, he passed one administered by the Michigan State Police.

As for being "pretty dumb about lie detectors," you should know that the consensus view among scientists is that polygraphy has no scientific basis. By contrast, virtually the only ones supporting the validity of polygraphy are those with vested interests in this pseudoscience. That would include Dr. Phil McGraw, who regularly uses the lie detector as a ratings gimmick. I think that which you should find outrageous is that McGraw, who with a Ph.D. in clinical psychology should know better, exploited Kaylee's plight by pretending that such quackery as polygraphy could resolve the serious question of whether she was sexually molested.

As you correctly note, Jeremy Park was arrested earlier this year (12 June 2008) and extradited from South Bend, Indiana to Berrien County, Michigan on charges of possession of child pornography. In a plea agreement, he pled guilty to two counts of "possession of child sexually abusive materials" and in August was sentenced to 270 days in jail and five years' probation:

http://www.nilesstar.com/articles/2008/06/14/news/ndnews4.txt

Arrest made on child porn charge

Saturday, June 14, 2008 7:35 AM EDT

ST. JOSEPH - A South Bend man is expected to be extradited to Berrien County on a warrant for child pornography charges.

On Thursday, June 12, at approximately 11:45 a.m. officers from the South Bend Police Department and the Berrien Springs Oronoko Township Police Department arrested Jeremy A. Park, 28, at his apartment at Bonfield Place in South Bend, Ind.

He was charged with four counts of possession of child sexually abusive material and four counts use of computer for criminal act.

Park was arrested on a warrant issued by the Berrien County Trial Court earlier this month resulting from an investigation that begin March 18.

Park was lodged in the St. Joseph County Jail pending extradition to Berrien County.

On March 18, officers from the Berrien Springs Oronoko Township Police Department responded to a report of a domestic assault at 9064 Kephart Lane, Berrien Springs.

At that time, Park alleged he had been assaulted by his wife. Officers were not able to substantiate that an assault occurred and no arrests were made on that allegation; but, as a result of the living conditions in the apartment along with the incident officers were called to, officers took the Park's one-year-old child into protective custody. Child Protective Services was notified and the child was placed into foster care at that time.

During the investigation a laptop computer was turned over to officers along with information that it contained child pornography on it.

A search warrant was obtained for the computer and it was analyzed by Det. Sgt. Mike Danneffel, a forensic computer analyst with the Berrien County Sheriff's Department.

Pornographic images and movies were located on the computer during the examination. The images and movies were examined by a doctor qualified as an expert in determining a person's age from the recovered evidence. It was determined that two images and two movies containing pornographic material were of an underage female.

Following the investigation by the Berrien Springs Oronoko Township Police Department and the Berrien County Sheriff's Department with assistance from the FBI, Berrien County Prosecutor Art Cotter authorized a warrant for Jeremy Park as specified, which was then issued by the Berrien County Trial Court.

This case remains under investigation.

http://www.sbtinfo.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20080812&Category=News01&ArtNo=808120390&SectionCat=News&Template=printart

Berrien Springs man sentenced in child-porn case
'Dr. Phil' show films session in Berrien court.
By DEBRA HAIGHT Tribune Correspondent

NILES -- It's not every day that a television crew from a nationally syndicated television show is filming inside a local courtroom, but that was the case Monday in Berrien County Trial Court here.

Jeremy Park, 28, of Berrien Springs, was sentenced for possession of child pornography.

He had appeared on the "Dr. Phil" show in late 2006 to defend himself against allegations that he has sexually abused his young daughter.

Krista Mehl, his ex-girlfriend and mother of his daughter, and her mother, Bonii Dyjasek, appeared on the show to make the allegations. No criminal charges have been filed as a result of the abuse allegations.

While the allegations made on the television show aren't connected with the pornography case, people from the "Dr. Phil" show were on hand to film Berrien County Trial Judge Scott Schofield's sentencing of Park. They plan to air the sentencing on their season opening show in early September.

In the criminal case, Park was sentenced on two counts of possession of child sexually abusive materials, which carry a maximum penalty of four years in prison.

He had originally been charged with two more counts of the child sexually abusive materials and four counts of use of a computer to possess child sexually abusive materials. Those six charges were dismissed as part of a plea agreement.

All eight charges stemmed from an investigation by the Berrien Springs/Oronoko Township Police Department in March. A laptop computer belonging to Park was turned over to police and pornographic images and videos were found on it.

Monday, Assistant Prosecutor Kelly Travis said she believes Park needs to be monitored, register as a sex offender and have no contact with minor children. For his part, Park said he was very regretful and ashamed of his actions and what it had done to himself and his family.

"It's nice you feel bad for yourself and your family, but the real victims are the children who were portrayed in the pornographic pictures," Schofield said. "They don't have the ability to consent.

"Their self-esteem and ability to form romantic relationships in the future are at terrible risk. There would be no reason for them to be forced into this activity if not for people like you willing to view and purchase it."

Park was placed on five years' probation and ordered to serve 270 days in jail with the first 90 in jail and the balance at the end of the probation term. He was given credit for 61 days already served and must also spend 180 days on tether after he's released from jail.

He must pay $2,120 in fines and costs and restitution of $1,255.74 to a leasing company he bought the computer from. He must register as a sex offender, not own a computer or camera and have no contact with children age 17 or younger. After the sentencing, Dyjasek, her family attorney James Boardman and Berrien Springs Police Chief Milt Agay spoke on camera to the "Dr. Phil" crew.

Agay said he is continuing to look at the child abuse allegations involving Park to see if charges can be brought in connection with that case. The initial investigation was closed in 2007 with no charges filed.

Boardman said he's looking to formally terminate Park's parental rights through proceedings in the Berrien County Trial Court's Family Division.

Dyjasek said she still blames Child Protective Services for not doing its job in protecting her granddaughter.

"CPS didn't do their job," she said. "Hopefully they'll not fail the next child calling out for help the way they failed. ... Not only does Jeremy have a lot to answer for, but also CPS has a lot to answer for." She said she and her daughter will continue to pursue justice for the young girl.

"We are going to pursue this case so there is justice for (the girl), this case is far from over. Krista said today that justice is only halfway served."

[Bob from Berrien]

Just to let you know that Jeremy Park was convicted of possession of child pornography (it was found on his personal computer).  I'm happy that you're still arguing "possibilities" while this scumbag was getting his jollies by looking at naked children.  Look it up if you don't believe me.

It's gratifying to know that even morons like you folks are allowed internet access.

[T.M. Cullen]

Barium Bob,

In the previous post, GM pointed out that this person plead guilty to the charge of possession of child porn.  Also, that Mr. Park both PASSED and FAILED separate polygraphs (two coin flips, coming up "tails" once, and "heads" once).  So you can't really base anything  on the polygraph.

Whether or not he molested his daughter is another matter.

TC

[bh]

And have you idiots now seen that he was found with ABUSIVE child porn and convicted of the same? And have you seen his living conditions, as reported by his parole officer?  Dr. Phil's supposed grandstanding aside, it was so OBVIOUS that his guy was a sick F*ck.  My God.  This a SEXUALLY ABUSED BABY.  What the hell is the matter with you, with the court, with CPS?  You're all talking about stupid BS and there is a BABY at stake here. What if it was yours?      

[stefano]

What the hell is the matter with you, with the court, with CPS?You're all talking about stupid BS and there is a BABY at stake here. What if it was yours? 

It's because we are here to discuss the inequities of the polygraph, not try to save the children of the world. If such is your quest, I'd suggest starting in Africa where they are starving and dying from pestilence.

And, by the way, your post is 6 years late.

[MsLauraLynn]

It would be in this websites interest to do a little MORE research in regard to this particular case. The polygraph test that Jeremy Park "passed" was checked by a different party. He did, in fact, FAIL! The poly that they said he 'passed' was given by a police dept employee that had an issue w the gma Bonnii. That employee deliberately LIED about Jeremy passing the poly. & whoever this "Paris" is that is showing a disgusting amount of compassion for this SCUMBAG PEDOPHILE, is no better than the pedophile herself. Some people are so gullible that can't see a blatant & obviously guilty person LYING through their teeth. It had nothing to do w DrPhils questioning. It had everything to do w microexpression & how to spot a LIAR. It's not a hard thing to do once you educate yourself & know what to look for. It was painfully obvious & anyone defending this trash thinking he's innocent...I hope to GOD they never have children!

[stefano]

That employee deliberately LIED about Jeremy passing the poly. & whoever this "Paris" is that is showing a disgusting amount of compassion for this SCUMBAG PEDOPHILE, is no better than the pedophile herself. Some people are so gullible that can't see a blatant & obviously guilty person LYING through their teeth.

So you are able to divine when someone is lying? Sounds to me like you have some unresolved anger issues.

[Teacher]

http://articles.southbendtribune.com/2011-04-05/news/29387024_1_kpep-kalamazoo-probation-enhancement-program-boot-camp

Time always tells.  Read this and keep bashing Dr. Phil! Jeremy Park should rot in Hell for what he did to his daughter!