Inappropriate behaviour during poly

[neko6]

I have a hypothetical question for you all:
If during one's poly session, the polygrapher keeps itching himself or adjusting himself (and by "himself" I mean his private parts) every time he stands up to talk about the questions or adjust the arm cuff. He doesn't try to hide it and does it in full view, though it's not quite the level of "sexual harassment". You (the examinee) finds this pretty disgusting and it makes you uncomfortable. The guy is a well-respected in-house polygrapher with a lot of experience. There is no video or two-way mirror as far as you know, so it's your word against his. Question is - do you say something to your applicant coordinator?

If you pass the poly -  would you be ostracized as a troublemaker before you even begin working in your dream job? (you don't have to see the polygrapher again)

If you fail the poly - would you be labeled a malcontent and get blacklisted by other agencies?

If you say nothing - he continues his behaviour, making other female examinees uncomfortable? (Bad considering studies have shown most women have experienced sexual assault of one form or another during their lifetime.)

Does it even matter? Or is this a surreptitious act to test your ethics and whether or not you will alert authority under difficult circumstances? Please some insight from the men in this forum, especially the polygraphers themselves. Advice?

[Twoblock]

neko6

This doesn't sounds hypothetical to me. It reads like you have experienced it.

I would say that he's a perverted SOB and should be reported to his chief. Even if he had the seven year itch down there he's showing perversion by scratching it in front of women. Would you want to work for a department that condones this crap?

[yankeedog]

Neko6,

Sounds like someone who is doing something obnoxious and you find offensive and bothersome.  I don't know your status with this agency, which is to say I don't know if you passed, did not pass, are still being considered or have been DQed.

Put yourself on the professional high road regardless of your status.  At some point, sit down with the examiner one-on-one, and explain to him what you observed and why you found it offensive.  Be professional and polite.  Make a memo of your meeting and keep it.  That way if you hear of additional, similar behavior in the future, you will have a record of what transpired.  If your examiner is a professional, he will listen to what you say and hopefully evaluate what he is doing.  He might not realize he is doing it.  Over the years I have listened to people I have tested and sometimes they tell me things I had not thought about, and make adjustments accordingly.  Sometimes I listen to them and make no adjustments at all.  It is a tough decision, but if you get into law enforcement (I assume that is what we are talking about) you will be faced with tough decisions throughout your career.  To make it easy, look inside yourself and "do what you know is right."  If you don't say something, how are you going to feel about yourself in the future.  Try to resolve problems at the lowest level.  If you aren't satisfied with his response or reaction, you can always take it a step hight.  Good luck.

[T.M. Cullen]

Well, there are perverted "antis" on this board who have puckered their anus during a test.   Now that is disgusting!!



Honestly, I am more concerned about the lying and trickery that goes on during a polygraph.  Old men scratch their particles, so what?

[sackett]

neko,

as you can tell "twoblock" hadn't taken his daily medication yet. Automatically assuming the guys a pervert...  Wonderful and insightful!

"Yankeedog" has a good idea, I have one which will take it a step further.

Is what the examiner was doing sexual harrassment?  Yes, it can be.  My thought was this.  Does he even know he's doing it?  Some guys, are overly attentive to their "privates" and if wearing uncomfortable drawers or slacks can be a reason why something like that occurs.  Now, if everytime he did it, he was looking at you to see a reaction, then he knew what was going on and a formal complaint made be the way to go.  If not, he may simply not be aware of his actions.

My suggestion is this.  Rather than confront the examiner or embarrass him in person, send an anonymous letter from "applicant" to the chief of the dept identifying the behavior and how unprofessional it was.  This is fairly innocuous and will not identify your gender.  If you write that it made you uncomfortable, they'll know you're a female since most guys don't find that too objectionable and ignore it; generally speaking.

This way, and regardless of your testing outcome, you will have come off anonymously professional and hopefully correct an inappropriate behavior.

Sackett

[neko6]

Is it common practice for a male polygrapher to be in a room,  alone and unmonitored, with a female examinee?

When I go to the doctor for a check-up, a nurse is always present during any kind of physical examination.

So then why is it that the law enforcement field is so different? Polygraphers have to touch you near sensitive areas to put the straps on you.

[sackett]

Is it common practice for a male polygrapher to be in a room,  alone and unmonitored, with a female examinee?

When I go to the doctor for a check-up, a nurse is always present during any kind of physical examination.

So then why is it that the law enforcement field is so different? Polygraphers have to touch you near sensitive areas to put the straps on you.

It depends on the dept in question.  Each is different.  

While you didn't know if present, a recording would not do you any good since without video, how could you tell he was grabbing himself.  A 2 way mirror probably would not be in use with a monitor since most pre-employments are boring and no-one wants to watch one unless necessary.

When placing the components on an examinee, minimal contact should occur with any examinee, though it is more important to be careful when dealing with the opposite sex. Pneumo tubes can be placed on a body without touching the person.  

Sackett

[Twoblock]

neko6

The SOB could be a child molester and polygraphers would come to his defense with lame brain excuses like "maybe he doesn't realize he is doing it". That's just plain BS. There is no reason for him to stand up to talk about the questions and repositioning his privates? Give me a break. I've been married to the same lady for 55 years and I don't scratch and reposition my privates in front of her because I think it's rude and disrespectful. I stand by my advice. Report him to his cheif or better yet file a sexual harrassment lawsuit on his butt.

BTW, neko6, if I am prescribed meds, I dutifully take them at the prescribed time.

[sackett]

twoblock,

it is truly telling to see you give no consideration for the possibility that this guy may very well be acting in a way that is inappropriate and doesn't even realize it.  I guess it is because he is an examiner and we are all evil...

Otherwise, EVERYONE who complains about their false positive is accepted without question.  Double standard, huh?!  

Sackett

[Twoblock]

To me morality hasn't a damn thing to with any profession.
This has nothing to do with polygraphy. I don't care if it's a docter, lawyer, polygrapher, LEO, etc., any man who repeatedly gets up from his chair and stands in front of a female and scratches his balls certainly is aware of what he is doing and should not be defended. Particularly by his profession.

If neko6 was my wife or daughter, the dude already would be hurting all over more than any place else. That would surely make him aware of his perverted actions.

[neko6]

What I'm really trying to get at here is, realistically, what kind of repercussions am I looking at if I do say something?

Would this be part of my "file" with the agency I applied to? Would I probably be labeled a malcontent if not passing and be blacklisted from other government jobs?

If he didn't know he was doing it and I said something to my app coordinator, then my career is over before it even began for absolutely no reason whatsoever.

[sackett]

There is no way to know; unless you're related to the chief.

Now I'm truly guessing here, but I think every female who was subjected to the same treatment will respect you and most guys will laugh at the whole thing (with the exception of the management who will have to deal with it somehow).

As for your file. If hired, no-one can say for sure how or even if it will effect your file/job folders, etc.  BUT, you must do something now!  Do not wait until later, else if not offered a position, it will appear to be sour grapes and summarily dissmissed.  

Sackett

[Twoblock]

neko6

I agree with Sackett. If you report it now and the dude fails you, you can counter with "his improper actions upset you", which is likely, and caused you to fail. This will probably get you retested with a different polygrapher. If you pass and the department doesn't hire you, then that's cause for both internal and external investigations. I would head straight for the news media. As I alway say "roll over and play dead and you get dirt thrown in your face". You should do every thing in your power to remove this guy so other females won't have to endure what you did.

[yankeedog]

What I'm really trying to get at here is, realistically, what kind of repercussions am I looking at if I do say something?

Would this be part of my "file" with the agency I applied to? Would I probably be labeled a malcontent if not passing and be blacklisted from other government jobs?

If he didn't know he was doing it and I said something to my app coordinator, then my career is over before it even began for absolutely no reason whatsoever.

This obviously has you very concerned, apparently.  And rightfully so.
 
Repercussions:  Officially, no.  Realistically, I have no idea because I don't know the agency or the personalities involved.  If you make a complaint to the agency, the Internal Affairs (IA) Office will probably investigate the allegation.  Your name would be in that file, but IA files are generally pretty secure files.  Sexual harassment in the workplace allegations are (or should be) taken seriously.  You have a female point of contact at the agency already.  Why not talk to her?  But remember, she is a member of that agency and will have to report what you say (at least she should).  You are in a situation where you have to do the right thing.  Either the examiner does not realize he is doing what you claim, or he is doing it on purpose.  In any event, it needs to stop.  And you are in a position to do something about it.  If one of my subordinates was doing something inappropriate, I would want to know.  Do you know if you are still being considered for employment?  Did you pass your polygraph test?  I hope you did pass and are still being considered.  If you did not pass, and are not being considered, the longer you wait the more it will appear that you are, in your words, a malcontent.

[neko6]

this sucks. i hate that this is what happened after i put all my faith in the process and the examiner. i knew i would get grilled, but never expected this. my advice to the female examinee lurkers - say something during the interview instead of waiting like me (feel free to post suggested replies to such a situation). to the male examiners lurking - please find another way to make your female examinees uncomfortable. ugh.

I don't think all examiners are bad - I just happened to be unlucky.

I don't want to say too much more about my situation, but at least i've found something the examiners and "antis" can agree on

I'll definitely say something to my contact after I pass a rough draft by a friend; I'm not the type to not do something about this. I just really don't want to deal with an IA investigation, and I have no interest in a lawsuit.

thanks for all the advice people :-)