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Topic summary

Posted by fatman1955
 - Aug 27, 2006, 03:59 AM
Bill thanks. Your insight and comments from a credible source really take me to another level of despair and mistrust in the polygraph system. I too have requested my polygraph test results under FOIA.  What little faith I had in the quality control process now appears too have disappeared. I see now why prior to the polygraph test being administered a consent form not allowing audio or video of the test has to be signed by the applicant. This is democracy at its finest!   :'(
Posted by Bill Crider
 - Aug 26, 2006, 11:51 PM
I went to Knoxville and took a private test with former head of FBI polygrpahy Kendall Shull to try and figure out why I couldnt pass. He told me that the purpse of the FBI HQ review is to ensure a level of consistency with the scoring. THis is typical of the entire FBI process. My understanding of it is that the HQ can overrule the original tester, tho  i am sure a lot of conversations go on behind the scenes if there is a disagreement.

However, I can tell you that after an hour of Mr Shull explaining to me how the testing and scoring worked (He actually called it "little bumps" and "big bumps"), I can tell you that the info in George's E-book and pamphlets on this site is very accurate. He was actually able to score my charts from my previous polygraphs (when i had obtained via FSiA request) despite the fact that the question #s and scoring notes had been redacted. He showed me on the charts where the HQ supervisor had signed the chart indicating it had been reviewed.
Posted by fatman1955
 - Aug 26, 2006, 03:40 AM
George, thanks.
Posted by George W. Maschke
 - Aug 26, 2006, 03:10 AM
fatman1955,

The most relevant information I could suggest is found in the FBI Manual of Investigative Operations and Guidelines, Section 67-7.10, Polygraph Examinations of FBI Applicants:

http://antipolygraph.org/documents/fbi-polygraph-guidelines.shtml

If you want to know how polygraph charts are scored, see the DoDPI Numerical Evaluation Scoring System:

http://antipolygraph.org/documents/dodpi-numerical-scoring-08-2004.pdf

and the DoDPI Law Enforcement Pre-Employment Test examiner's guide:

http://antipolygraph.org/documents/dodpi-lepet.pdf

"Quality control" is addressed in very general terms in the Federal Psychophysiological Detection of Deception Examiner Handbook:

http://antipolygraph.org/documents/federal-polygraph-handbook-01-03-2004.pdf

The FBI has its own polygraph operator's manual that is classified "secret."
Posted by fatman1955
 - Aug 25, 2006, 11:29 PM
Fair Chance, understood. I have read numerous responses on this site from individuals who at one time or another were part of the FBI polygraph process before becoming advocates to have it abolished. The official policy I am sure is not classified! I am not trying to discover how polygraph operators determine how individuals (innocent or guilty) surreptitiously pass the test. I really do not think it is right to teach individuals countermeasures to beat the test. I understand that agencies like the FBI have to have a standard to weed out undesirables. My only argument is if someone fails a polygraph there is an agency oversight policy to ensure fairness of results. Why even have applicants fill out a SF86 prior to giving the initial polygraph! All I was requesting is any members that visit this site that know what the policy is let us all know about it. I can live with failing the polygraph, even though I told the truth, as long as there was an unbiased review of my results. I still do not understand why individuals are not provided with verified proof of accusations before job offers are withdrawn. If no one wants to go on the record with the official policy, just provide me with the FBI policy letter number and date. I am sure if there is any defenders of the polygraph out there here is your chance to show the polygraph is fair and just.
Posted by Fair Chance
 - Aug 25, 2006, 07:15 PM
Fatman1955,

This is the frustration of the whole process.  There is no public policy available.  The applicant must "successfully pass a pre-employment polygraph exam."  That is it.  There are no rules of engagement.  Do a search on Google or any engine you want and you will find the vast vacuum of no concrete information.  This site is about as good as it gets for information.  I wish we could get the information you seek.

Regards.
Posted by fatman1955
 - Aug 25, 2006, 03:58 AM
I am really surprised that this question hit a brick wall. It would appear with the wealth of knowledge of members of this site (anti-polygraph or pro-polygraph) and the amount of people who have claimed to be victimized by the polygraph no one seems to know what happens once you are accused of lying other than getting a letter of rejection. I do not feel that the polygraph will ever be abolished until applicants understand the administrative process because appeals seem to have a low success rate. I can not believe the initial polygraph operator's opinion to his/her headquarters has that much weight because of possible mistakes during the test. If the polygraph is so scientifically unsound, there has to be an oversight process that legitimizes the final results. There has to be an official FBI policy governing polygraph final results. Does anyone know?  
Posted by fatman1955
 - Aug 16, 2006, 02:34 AM
What is the official process once the polygraph test is over to determine if a pre-employment applicant passes or fails? What is the FBI's official quality control process from start to finish and who at HQ FBI makes the final determination? Also, what is ultimately put into the official FBI file as a result of a failed pre-employment polygraph?  ???