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Topic summary

Posted by George W. Maschke
 - Oct 28, 2005, 02:42 AM
Quote from: Eastwood on Oct 27, 2005, 11:20 PMDo what you want, but George's advice is DEAD WRONG....

Prove it.
Posted by Eastwood
 - Oct 27, 2005, 11:20 PM
Do what you want, but George's advice is DEAD WRONG.  If you think it's caused you a problem on the tests, tell them.  George sure isn't looking out for your best interest - or anyone else's.
Posted by Eastwood
 - Oct 27, 2005, 11:18 PM
Quote from: George W. Maschke on Oct 13, 2005, 04:21 AM

It is never in an applicant's self-interest to disclose derogatory information about him- or herself that would not be discovered in the course of a background investigation. Applicants do, however, have an ethical obligation to answer relevant questions truthfully. If the matter you mention is not actually responsive to any of the relevant questions, you have no ethical obligation to divulge it and would probably be wise not to.

"Great" advice George - your response has told me everything i need to know about you.  This guy obviously had it on his mind and, very clearly, it's causing him a problem on a test that he really shouldn't have to worry about - your advice to withhold it is asinine.  

Edited to correct coding problem (reply was within quote) -- AntiPolygraph.org Administrator
Posted by bailyt
 - Oct 23, 2005, 08:45 PM
Just curious, how much time passed between your 2nd and 3rd polygraph.  Was it before or after a BI? -b
Posted by George W. Maschke
 - Oct 15, 2005, 03:54 AM
Quote from: opp on Oct 14, 2005, 06:10 PMFrom what I have heard the CIA WILL NOT hire anyone who has paid for sex (oral as well). I am telling you, if you admit to it, you are done. Anyone here will tell you that. It is also a good question for George.

I have not heard of this before.

QuoteThe CIA will also share this information.

That's a safe bet.
Posted by sprint2005
 - Oct 14, 2005, 08:28 PM
What is a quality assurance level?  Is it a good thing if it went up?  
Posted by opp
 - Oct 14, 2005, 06:10 PM
From what I have heard the CIA WILL NOT hire anyone who has paid for sex (oral as well). I am telling you, if you admit to it, you are done. Anyone here will tell you that. It is also a good question for George. The CIA will also share this information.
Posted by sprint2005
 - Oct 14, 2005, 01:41 AM
You think I won't be cleared even if I admit to it and already have a DoD TS/SCI and have passed recent CI Poly's...this would be the only skeleton in my closet and I've never used drugs
Posted by opp
 - Oct 13, 2005, 11:13 AM
If you admit having paid for oral sex, you are going to fail and it will be part of your record.
Posted by George W. Maschke
 - Oct 13, 2005, 04:21 AM
Quote from: sprint2005 on Oct 12, 2005, 07:41 PMI'm going into my third CIA Poly and haven't talked about oral sex I paid for on 3 occasions...obviously I haven't passed the first 2...should I admit it now and say I was embarrassed to talk about it/didn't think it was an issue.  It was never really a direct question but I'm assuming that it's what is on my mind that is causing me to fail it...there is nothing else that I've done that could be an issue other than cheating on my girlfriend that I've admitted to?  

Will doing so cause more harm or is it the right thing to do?

It is never in an applicant's self-interest to disclose derogatory information about him- or herself that would not be discovered in the course of a background investigation. Applicants do, however, have an ethical obligation to answer relevant questions truthfully. If the matter you mention is not actually responsive to any of the relevant questions, you have no ethical obligation to divulge it and would probably be wise not to.

You are wrong to assume that it is necessarily something on your mind that is causing you to "fail." Polygraphy has absolutely no scientific basis, and the polygraph cannot read your mind. Virtually everyone who sits for the CIA pre-employment polygraph is initially accused of deception and/or withholding information, badgered for admissions, and brought back for one or more "re-tests." The whole process is a massive bluff to get potentially disqualifying admissions.

Telling the truth is no guarantee that you'll pass, as you've already learned by experience. Providing unasked for information is no guarantee that you'll pass, either. But what you can be sure of is that any admissions you make will become a matter of permanent record, and despite any guarantees of confidentiality you may have received, may be disclosed to other federal agencies. (See the message thread, CIA Released My Sexual History.)

For related informed commentary, see Melissa Boyle Mahle on CIA Polygraph Policy. See also the CIA-related statements on the Personal Statements page. You'll also find relevant discussion of the CIA's use of polygraphy, as well as an exposition of the probable-lie "control question test" technique used by the CIA and many other agencies for pre-employment polygraph screening, in The Lie Behind the Lie Detector.
Posted by sprint2005
 - Oct 12, 2005, 11:06 PM
on the last try he said i was having a problem with one question so we ran the test a third time...he sort of said it in passing but loud enough to hear.  He was clear in asking if I was willing to come back and I made it clear that I was.  I guess I will have to just suck it up and say it...totally not me anymore but I also didn't talk about it earlier so they are going to think I kept it from them, especially since it happened on 3 occasions.  They were very aggresive and dominated all conversation...had an attitude of you are not telling me the truth throughout.
Posted by sprint2005
 - Oct 12, 2005, 09:22 PM
Well it never really came up...they just kept asking what else is ther and for some reason I didn't think it was that big a deal but I guess it is.  

I guess it was more of an embarrassment issue...is that a valid excuse.  
Posted by sprint2005
 - Oct 12, 2005, 07:41 PM
I'm going into my third CIA Poly and haven't talked about oral sex I paid for on 3 occasions...obviously I haven't passed the first 2...should I admit it now and say I was embarrassed to talk about it/didn't think it was an issue.  It was never really a direct question but I'm assuming that it's what is on my mind that is causing me to fail it...there is nothing else that I've done that could be an issue other than cheating on my girlfriend that I've admitted to?  

Will doing so cause more harm or is it the right thing to do?