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A forum for free and open discussion of polygraph-related topics
Posted by George W. Maschke
- Mar 26, 2005, 08:03 AMRegarding your question, there are no scientific studies on the effects of any medical conditions or medications on polygraphic lie tests. Note that lie detector "testing" has not been proven through peer-reviewed research to reliably differentiate truth from deception at better-than-chance levels of accuracy under field conditions in people without any chronic medical conditions, let alone those who do. Polygraph "testing" is, as you said, a case of "garbage in, garbage out." The various measurements recorded by the polygraph instrument have no clear connection with deception or truth-telling.
The polygraph's main utility is as an interrogatory prop. Offering a polygraph "test" often serves as a pretext for interrogating a suspect in the absence of legal counsel. Confronted with the news that the polygraph has found them deceptive, guilty suspects sometimes confess, as in the recent case of John Evander Couey, who promptly confessed to the sexual assault and murder of 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford following a polygraph examination, before even being informed of the results. In this regard, it should be noted that the victim's innocent grandmother had earlier failed the polygraph. (The Citrus County, Florida sheriff used the euphemism that her answers "raised red flags.")
The polygraph's main utility is as an interrogatory prop. Offering a polygraph "test" often serves as a pretext for interrogating a suspect in the absence of legal counsel. Confronted with the news that the polygraph has found them deceptive, guilty suspects sometimes confess, as in the recent case of John Evander Couey, who promptly confessed to the sexual assault and murder of 9-year-old Jessica Lunsford following a polygraph examination, before even being informed of the results. In this regard, it should be noted that the victim's innocent grandmother had earlier failed the polygraph. (The Citrus County, Florida sheriff used the euphemism that her answers "raised red flags.")
Posted by theignorantone
- Mar 26, 2005, 05:13 AMThanks George. Yes I do have a pretty decent attorney that the court appointed. He is not free as I'm making monthly payments at the ourt house. I don't understand the process. Try and put youself in my shoes. I was born and raised in a small German village in Ohio of less than 1500 people. Everybody knows your business. Everybody is hard working and honest. Nobody ever locks there doors or takes there keys from there cars. Our crime rate is maybe an occasional DUI, but everybody that is local knows that it can be avoided just by calling 911 so the local officer can give you a ride home. Yea, we have 5 bars but 7 churches. And yes I have to admit we do like our beer. The is a community where if you leave on vacation for two weeks your neighbors will mow and trim your lawn, water your flowers, take your trash out on trash day, and water your indoor plants as well. If I would have to register as a sex offender I would never be able to go back home to live.
Posted by George W. Maschke
- Mar 25, 2005, 06:35 PMIt was a mistake to agree to a polygraph "test." Polygraphy has no scientific basis whatsoever, and it is inherently biased against the truthful. For further reading about the scientific status of polygraphy (it's in the same league as the pseudosciences of phrenology and graphology), see Chapter 1 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector and the sources cited there. Chapter 3 provides further detail about the procedure itself.
I think it would be wise to refuse to submit to any further interrogations (with or without a polygraph) without a lawyer present. You stand accused of a very serious crime (I'm assuming CSC II means "Criminal Sexual Conduct II" under Michigan law). It would be a mistake to suppose that because you're innocent you don't need legal counsel. If you don't know a lawyer in your area, Martindale's lawyer locator service may be helpful in finding one near you:
http://www.martindale.com
I think it would be wise to refuse to submit to any further interrogations (with or without a polygraph) without a lawyer present. You stand accused of a very serious crime (I'm assuming CSC II means "Criminal Sexual Conduct II" under Michigan law). It would be a mistake to suppose that because you're innocent you don't need legal counsel. If you don't know a lawyer in your area, Martindale's lawyer locator service may be helpful in finding one near you:
http://www.martindale.com
Posted by theignorantone
- Mar 25, 2005, 06:06 PMFirst of all let me say that i'am just a peon and don't have any professional background in law inforcement of any kind. I just found this web sight today and did not know that it existed until today, I'am happy that I have discovered it. Although I have had the upmost respect for every law inforcement agency that I have come into contact in my life. And yes I have personally aided in several drug busts and even a fereral bust helping the FCC bust a person interfeering with the county sheriffs repeater, I have been a model citizen my whole life. Yea, ok I been a ham for over 25 years that my knowledge helped with this task, most of that time devoted to public service. I have a squekey cleen record as one would say. . but still nothing makes any difference. I am neer 55 years old and had to retire on dissability due to work injuries. I worked hard my whole life for about 35 years working 60- 80 hours a week 6-7 days a week. I am divorced. My x-wife and I had two sons, we raised both of them as good christians. Both of them were confirmed into a church, both of them are Eagle Scouts. I believe this spells out what is known as vamily values.
OK, MY STORY:
I was involved in babysitting my fiances grandchildren for over 1/12 years. All of a sudden I am charged with CSC II from her step granduaghter. The county sheriffs department questioned me and I cooperated 100% with them as I know that I have not done anything wrong. I could not believe the way that they acted towards me. I felt like I was presumed quilty on the charges. I wanted to clear all the BS up and the best way they said there was to do that was to submit to a poloygraph test.
My first poly graph test: Before going into the exam I asked the examiner how medications affected the exam. I was told, a bull shit answer, didn't realize it at the time! That there is not any evidence to support that any medications affect the poloygraph.
My Medical History:
I suffer from high blood pressure, diabetes, arthritis, depression, anxiety, congestive heart failure, and reflex sympathetic dystrophy of the upper left body. I take medications for all the above conditions. For my cronic pain from Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy I take the medications Neutontin 300 mg. X 3 a day; a drug for epelipsy. Desyrel, 150 mg. at bedtime, Librium 25 mg. at bedtime for sleep. Also Percocet and Oxycontin as needed, which I take very sparingly. The medications effect my nerves, blood pressure, breathing, perspiration, everthing that a poloygraph monitors. I did not realize this at this time, as I never had anything to worry about. I'm just an honest German desendent in a German Village my whole life, that has never done anything wrong.
THE POLYGRAPH EXAMINER: I did complain that he was so slow between questions, taking 1 1/2 to 2 full minutes between questions. I read a list of about 15 control questions sence then, I was read every one of them before both my exams. The first exan was deemed as inconsclusive. BS, how, I told nothing but the absolute truth! I asked for a re-examination to clear my good name of this nightmare I was being drug through. I could not sleep the night before because I was so upset. I was even falling asleep between his long pauses between questions, even once waking up, gasping for air. He must have thougt I was deceptive because he deemed that I failed the test in his word as "kentuckey windage", or in other words it was his gut instinct that I was lying. BS, I told nothing but the truth.
MY QUESTIONS ARE? I'am sorry my post was interupted!
Is there anyplace where I can find evidence on the the Epilipsy drug Neutontin and the effects on a polygraph? I have written Pfizer the manufacture of the drug but I don't get any responce. The only answer I have found so far is, "garbage in garbage out". That just doesn't satisfy me when I'am looking at 15 years for something that I didn't do.
My trial comes up in about 7 weeks in circuit court. My attorney says that they are not allowed to bring the polygraph up at my trial. Just like we are not allowed to bring it up that I'am the third person this sick child has accused before the age of 13. The second one is doing time because his, "public defender" told him to plead guilty or he was going to prison for life. He was charged with 2 charges of CSC 1 and one of CSC 2. They dropped the CSC 1 charges if he plead guilty to the CSC 2. He still swears that he is innocent to this day and I believe him after my ordeal.
If I had known then what I have learned about polopgraphs after the fact I shure would not have taken the test.
I feel like my life has gone down the gutter. I have attempted sucide in the past just to stop my cronic pain from my RSD. This isn't making it any easyer on me.
I just don't understand why this female prosicuter wants my balls on the wall when everything else points towards my innocence? I feel like i'am being prosicuted be a broke county system that thinke I have a little money and they want it, yea right, my Social Security check pretty puney but it is all I have.
Thanks for letting me vent, I'am glad I found this forum.
The ignorant one
OK, MY STORY:
I was involved in babysitting my fiances grandchildren for over 1/12 years. All of a sudden I am charged with CSC II from her step granduaghter. The county sheriffs department questioned me and I cooperated 100% with them as I know that I have not done anything wrong. I could not believe the way that they acted towards me. I felt like I was presumed quilty on the charges. I wanted to clear all the BS up and the best way they said there was to do that was to submit to a poloygraph test.
My first poly graph test: Before going into the exam I asked the examiner how medications affected the exam. I was told, a bull shit answer, didn't realize it at the time! That there is not any evidence to support that any medications affect the poloygraph.
My Medical History:
I suffer from high blood pressure, diabetes, arthritis, depression, anxiety, congestive heart failure, and reflex sympathetic dystrophy of the upper left body. I take medications for all the above conditions. For my cronic pain from Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy I take the medications Neutontin 300 mg. X 3 a day; a drug for epelipsy. Desyrel, 150 mg. at bedtime, Librium 25 mg. at bedtime for sleep. Also Percocet and Oxycontin as needed, which I take very sparingly. The medications effect my nerves, blood pressure, breathing, perspiration, everthing that a poloygraph monitors. I did not realize this at this time, as I never had anything to worry about. I'm just an honest German desendent in a German Village my whole life, that has never done anything wrong.
THE POLYGRAPH EXAMINER: I did complain that he was so slow between questions, taking 1 1/2 to 2 full minutes between questions. I read a list of about 15 control questions sence then, I was read every one of them before both my exams. The first exan was deemed as inconsclusive. BS, how, I told nothing but the absolute truth! I asked for a re-examination to clear my good name of this nightmare I was being drug through. I could not sleep the night before because I was so upset. I was even falling asleep between his long pauses between questions, even once waking up, gasping for air. He must have thougt I was deceptive because he deemed that I failed the test in his word as "kentuckey windage", or in other words it was his gut instinct that I was lying. BS, I told nothing but the truth.
MY QUESTIONS ARE? I'am sorry my post was interupted!
Is there anyplace where I can find evidence on the the Epilipsy drug Neutontin and the effects on a polygraph? I have written Pfizer the manufacture of the drug but I don't get any responce. The only answer I have found so far is, "garbage in garbage out". That just doesn't satisfy me when I'am looking at 15 years for something that I didn't do.
My trial comes up in about 7 weeks in circuit court. My attorney says that they are not allowed to bring the polygraph up at my trial. Just like we are not allowed to bring it up that I'am the third person this sick child has accused before the age of 13. The second one is doing time because his, "public defender" told him to plead guilty or he was going to prison for life. He was charged with 2 charges of CSC 1 and one of CSC 2. They dropped the CSC 1 charges if he plead guilty to the CSC 2. He still swears that he is innocent to this day and I believe him after my ordeal.
If I had known then what I have learned about polopgraphs after the fact I shure would not have taken the test.
I feel like my life has gone down the gutter. I have attempted sucide in the past just to stop my cronic pain from my RSD. This isn't making it any easyer on me.
I just don't understand why this female prosicuter wants my balls on the wall when everything else points towards my innocence? I feel like i'am being prosicuted be a broke county system that thinke I have a little money and they want it, yea right, my Social Security check pretty puney but it is all I have.
Thanks for letting me vent, I'am glad I found this forum.
The ignorant one