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Posted by 1904
- May 30, 2007, 12:20 PMQuote from: underlyingtruth on Mar 23, 2007, 02:26 AMQuote
It appears that if a test subject feels discomfort on the comparison questions it indicates deception. However, if he feels discomfort on the "real" questions that also indicates deception. You seem to be making mutually exclusive statements. But perhaps I'm just missing something.
Sorry Sergeant, but you did miss it this time. Albeit a subtle difference, please allow me to clarify for you.
If the test subject feels discomfort on the comparison questions – it indicates deception.
If the test subject does NOT feel discomfort on the comparison questions – it "would have been shown to be MORE CLEARLY deceptive".
See the difference? Glad I could clear that up for you.
If you fail, you're lying.
If you are inconclusive, you're lying.
If you pass, somehow you got away with lying.
Hello boys. You both missed something. You both made the same assumption - i.e that the
husband in question has in fact 'played' with his penis and then lied to the examiner about the
'game'.
What is "playing with your penis?" The question is BS.
The xaminer assumes that the subject will equate 'playing' with masturbating, which he may not do.
Then, what if he has Never 'played' with his penis.....? what then. ? Huh?
The question is embarassing and will produce a reasonable reaction because it is an inference that
the subject does 'play with himself' and is therefore a sicko.
Making assumptions in order to construct a CQ of the same 'weight' as the RQ is a dangerous game.
Worse than 'playing' with your pecker.
Why not construct Lie controls...? much safer.
PS: Which scoring p/g scoring software produces shades of red as described???
and, It seems that the examiner had no confidence in his ability to score his charts manually.
Scoring software is bigger BS than the p/g itself.
...mmmm wonder if that wasn't maybe a Truster Pro or magic lamp....... :-?
Posted by underlyingtruth
- Mar 23, 2007, 02:26 AMQuote from: Sergeant1107 on Mar 21, 2007, 08:50 PM
It appears that if a test subject feels discomfort on the comparison questions it indicates deception. However, if he feels discomfort on the "real" questions that also indicates deception. You seem to be making mutually exclusive statements. But perhaps I'm just missing something.
Sorry Sergeant, but you did miss it this time. Albeit a subtle difference, please allow me to clarify for you.
If the test subject feels discomfort on the comparison questions – it indicates deception.
If the test subject does NOT feel discomfort on the comparison questions – it "would have been shown to be MORE CLEARLY deceptive".
See the difference? Glad I could clear that up for you.
If you fail, you're lying.
If you are inconclusive, you're lying.
If you pass, somehow you got away with lying.
Posted by Sergeant1107
- Mar 21, 2007, 08:50 PMQuote from: LieBabyCryBaby on Mar 21, 2007, 12:00 AMThose questions that made your husband feel so uncomfortable were actually what we polygraphers call "comparison" questions. They have nothing to do with the alleged infidelity. They are designed to have something to compare to the real questions about infidelity. The fact that your husband felt so uncomfortable with those comparison questions leads me to believe that there is in fact deception with regard to the real questions. When a test subject focuses more on the comparison questions than the real questions, he/she will, almost all of the time, pass the test. On the other hand, if these comparison questions had caused him no discomfort at all, he would have been shown to be more clearly deceptive. However, you didn't give us the wording for the real questions that dealt with the allegation of infidelity.
I must be missing something here. You wrote that:
- The questions that made her husband feel uncomfortable were comparison questions.
Because her husband felt uncomfortable with the comparison questions, that leads you to believe he was being deceptive with regards to the real questions.
You believe this because when a test subject focuses more on the comparison questions he will usually pass the test.
However, if he had not felt any discomfort on the comparison questions he would have been shown to be more clearly deceptive.
It appears that if a test subject feels discomfort on the comparison questions it indicates deception. However, if he feels discomfort on the "real" questions that also indicates deception. You seem to be making mutually exclusive statements. But perhaps I'm just missing something.
Posted by ecchasta
- Mar 21, 2007, 01:20 AMA polygraph test is nothing more than a prop assisted interrogation. Absent a confession, all other "results" are meaningless.
Your husband may be an adulterer, but the polygraph exam results are NOT evidence that it did or didn't happen.
Your husband may be an adulterer, but the polygraph exam results are NOT evidence that it did or didn't happen.
Posted by LieBabyCryBaby
- Mar 21, 2007, 12:00 AMQuote from: Yvonne on Mar 19, 2007, 03:37 PM
My husband is really upset and is telling me that we were scamed. He mentioned that the questions he was asked did make him feel uncomfortable, questions like " do you ever play with your penis" , "do you watch porn" " does porn get you excited" he told me that he feet uncomfortable with those questions and that yes it made him breath more, I dont know what to believe I am really concidering a divorse but would hate to go through this if there is a chance that this test can be inaccurate.
Those questions that made your husband feel so uncomfortable were actually what we polygraphers call "comparison" questions. They have nothing to do with the alleged infidelity. They are designed to have something to compare to the real questions about infidelity. The fact that your husband felt so uncomfortable with those comparison questions leads me to believe that there is in fact deception with regard to the real questions. When a test subject focuses more on the comparison questions than the real questions, he/she will, almost all of the time, pass the test. On the other hand, if these comparison questions had caused him no discomfort at all, he would have been shown to be more clearly deceptive. However, you didn't give us the wording for the real questions that dealt with the allegation of infidelity.
The polygraph is not perfect. We polygraphers know that it is highly accurate when conducted by an experienced, skilled examiner. But no polygrapher worth his weight in polygraph charts would claim that your husband was "guilty" without a doubt.
To be frank, I find it disheartening when one spouse or lover in a relationship has to "prove" his/her love and faithfulness by taking a polygraph test. If you can't trust your husband's word without resorting to a machine and without relying on a polygrapher's skill or lack thereof, why are you still with him? Either trust him or don't, I say.
Posted by George W. Maschke
- Mar 19, 2007, 04:03 PMYvonne,
First, you need to know that yes, there is a very good chance of polygraph results being inaccurate. The only ones claiming that polygraph testing is highly accurate are the polygraph operators themselves. The consensus view among scientists is that polygraph testing has no scientific basis whatsoever. See, for example, Professor William G. Iacono's article, "Forensic 'Lie Detection': Procedures Without Scientific Basis":
http://antipolygraph.org/articles/article-018.shtml
The questions about playing with one's penis, watching pornography, and getting excited by it were "control" questions that are expected to provoke a physiological response. If your husband had reacted more strongly to such questions than to the relevant questions (about adultery), he would have passed. That he failed indicates only that he reacted more strongly to the relevant questions, not that he is lying.
It is not unusual for a falsely accused person to react more strongly when truthfully answering an accusatory relevant question about an issue of great importance than when answering a "control" question.
Note that had your husband been a liar intent on beating the polygraph, he could have easily learned how to do so. AntiPolygraph.org provides detailed information on how to pass a polygraph in our free e-book, The Lie Behind the Lie Detector:
https://antipolygraph.org/lie-behind-the-lie-detector.pdf
We provide this information in order to give honest people the means to protect themselves against the risk of a false positive outcome, but this same information can also be used by liars to pass.
I think that you should accord the polygraph results no weight at all, as they are, in fact, evidence of nothing. Relying on unreliable polygraph chart readings is foolhardy and may well lead to needless harm. See the following public statement by Gary Smith for an example of such harm:
https://antipolygraph.org/statements/statement-028.pdf
Regarding polygraph operator Ted Todd, the following message thread may be of interest:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1392.msg11074#msg11074
First, you need to know that yes, there is a very good chance of polygraph results being inaccurate. The only ones claiming that polygraph testing is highly accurate are the polygraph operators themselves. The consensus view among scientists is that polygraph testing has no scientific basis whatsoever. See, for example, Professor William G. Iacono's article, "Forensic 'Lie Detection': Procedures Without Scientific Basis":
http://antipolygraph.org/articles/article-018.shtml
The questions about playing with one's penis, watching pornography, and getting excited by it were "control" questions that are expected to provoke a physiological response. If your husband had reacted more strongly to such questions than to the relevant questions (about adultery), he would have passed. That he failed indicates only that he reacted more strongly to the relevant questions, not that he is lying.
It is not unusual for a falsely accused person to react more strongly when truthfully answering an accusatory relevant question about an issue of great importance than when answering a "control" question.
Note that had your husband been a liar intent on beating the polygraph, he could have easily learned how to do so. AntiPolygraph.org provides detailed information on how to pass a polygraph in our free e-book, The Lie Behind the Lie Detector:
https://antipolygraph.org/lie-behind-the-lie-detector.pdf
We provide this information in order to give honest people the means to protect themselves against the risk of a false positive outcome, but this same information can also be used by liars to pass.
I think that you should accord the polygraph results no weight at all, as they are, in fact, evidence of nothing. Relying on unreliable polygraph chart readings is foolhardy and may well lead to needless harm. See the following public statement by Gary Smith for an example of such harm:
https://antipolygraph.org/statements/statement-028.pdf
Regarding polygraph operator Ted Todd, the following message thread may be of interest:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1392.msg11074#msg11074
Posted by Yvonne
- Mar 19, 2007, 03:37 PMMy husband failed a polygraph test yeterday on infedility, I have been devested by this, after reading thi site, im not sure what to believe. He payed $600.00 to get this test done,(online stated $400.00 after calling them up for infedility the cost went up $200.00 more) and for him to put up that much money I really thought he was going to pass. The agreement was that if he passed the test, my father would reimburse him, so he had to problem taking it, all week he reassured me that after this test we can move on with our lives together and put this behind us, the reason I had him take this test is because I checked our wireless phone bill online a noticed he has been calling another women everyday for the pass 2 years (on record) this women he at first denied any sexual contact with her and they are just friends, this went on for about a week untill I mentioned that I want him to take this test, well hours later he confessed to sleeping with her before we got married, 2 1/2 years ago, he swears since we have beeen married nothing has ever happened, I find that very hard to belive untill he agreed to take this test with no hesitations, so he did, after taking it 5 times, the tst indicated that he was being deceptive, there were 3 shades of red the brightes being deceptive and the darkest being somewhat deceptive which he was in, I really dont understand that.
The examiner , Tedd Todd of concord, CA. mentioned to me that he cant say that he forsure he had sexual intercourse , but that it does show that he is being somewhat deceptive when it comes to sexual contact.
My husband is really upset and is telling me that we were scamed. He mentioned that the questions he was asked did make him feel uncomfortable, questions like " do you ever play with your penis" , "do you watch porn" " does porn get you excited" he told me that he feet uncomfortable with those questions and that yes it made him breath more, I dont know what to believe I am really concidering a divorse but would hate to go through this if there is a chance that this test can be inaccurate.
I would like to hear anyones input on this.
Thank You
The examiner , Tedd Todd of concord, CA. mentioned to me that he cant say that he forsure he had sexual intercourse , but that it does show that he is being somewhat deceptive when it comes to sexual contact.
My husband is really upset and is telling me that we were scamed. He mentioned that the questions he was asked did make him feel uncomfortable, questions like " do you ever play with your penis" , "do you watch porn" " does porn get you excited" he told me that he feet uncomfortable with those questions and that yes it made him breath more, I dont know what to believe I am really concidering a divorse but would hate to go through this if there is a chance that this test can be inaccurate.
I would like to hear anyones input on this.
Thank You