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My CIA Polygraph Story (Read 51558 times)
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My CIA Polygraph Story
Jun 24th, 2011 at 6:14pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
I waited a while to post this because I needed to let myself cool off.  It is amazing to sit back and reflect that I was at one point recruited by the CIA.  I was so close to having my dream career.  A life of not telling people where I work or what I do, knowing that terrorist probably want me dead, and a life of adventure.  The secret recruitment trips to DC were fun at the time, but now all for naught.

After applying online and dropping off my resume to recruiters at career fairs, I was eventually (like many months later…so forget that 45-day CIA rule) granted an interview at the CIA Dulles Discovery Building in Chantilly VA, off Rt.28 and Air & Space Museum Pkwy.  It was a standard interview, with standard behavior based questions, no surprises.  About a month later, I received a Conditional Offer of Employment (COE) from the CIA in the mail, with my COE letter and all of the paperwork to fill out, including a intrusive medical form and the famous SF-86 security clearance form (the CIA at this time makes applicants fill this form out by hand, there is no electronic version like e-QIP).  After returning my COE stuff, I had to wait several more months before I was called in for the famous 3-day processing (medical, psychological, and polygraph exams…plus an office visit). A few months prior to the 3-day, I had a phone security interview with the CIA where I basically went over my entire SF-86 ten-year history again.  They were concerned mostly about crime, drugs, and misuse of technology systems.  Downloading music, though it is illegal, does not disqualify you.  Most people especially college students did this, just pretend you didn’t know that it was illegal.  Minor drug use in college does not automatically disqualify you if it was minimal and over a year ago, thank God! 

The 3-day processing also occurs in the Dulles Discovery Bldg.  The CIA will fly you in and put you in a hotel and give you a very generous reimbursement, much more than your trip expenses!  My hotel had a complimentary shuttle to this building.  I’m sure the hotel staff knows that it is a CIA building, but we just refer to it as “Dulles Discovery” so that neither one of us risks being shot and killed.  Lol.  There is enough security in this building to thwart any potential terrorist or threat.  No cell phones allowed. They give you a key and a small locker in the visitor center to store your cell phone and other electronic devices.  No weapons either.  I know this is VA, but don't even think to exercise your right to bear arms in this building!  You take a little shuttle bus from the visitor center to the next building which is the Applicant Processing Unit.  Honestly you could really walk to this building if you aren’t lazy.  There may be about 20 or so other applicants there for their processing at the same time.  Nobody really talks to each other because we are all nervous and don't know what to say.  Cameras are all over the ceiling.  The Applicant Processing on the 2nd floor waiting area is big, clean, relaxing, has plenty of tables and chairs and cushion chairs and sofas, and magazines to read.  Makes you feel at home.  They make you sign in with first name only.

Everyone’s 3-day schedule may vary, but the appointments are the same, just in a different order maybe.  Day 1 consists of a 3-4 hour polygraph and medical test.  The medical test draws blood from your arm and you piss in a cup.  They test you for drugs, HIV, other STDs, and other stuff.  Standard. They also test your vision and hearing.  Don't worry; wearing contacts or glasses is ok.  They just want to make sure that you aren't deaf or blind, though if you were, I’m sure accommodations could be made since the CIA hires disabled people.   Day 2 is another polygraph and a psychological test.  The psych test is the famous MMPI-2 psychological test with 567 questions (Google it.  There is even a thread on this forum about it).  You also chat with a shrink who will go over your results with you.  Day 3 is the office visit. The office visit will vary depending on which office is recruiting you.   Mines took place in the same building and I talked to someone in the office that was recruiting me.  We have general chat about daily job tasks, dress code, security measures, where to live in DC or VA, personal and social life (the CIA generally “parties” with each other and FBI, Secret Service, NSA, DIA, and other top secret government people), etc. 

Anyway, on to the polygraph...

I’ll never forget my polygraph. This will be my first experience with this device ever, like most applicants. I came to Antipolygraph.org because I was afraid of getting falsely accused of being deceptive.  My polygrapher seemed nice and friendly, asks me how was my flight and weekend, cracks a few jokes, all of which I think is standard procedure to give me the false sense that I’ve made a new friend.  We enter the polygraph room.  There is a camera in one upper corner of the room, and a two-way mirror in the back.  If there were any additional cameras hidden, I didn’t see them.  The room looks just like a small office.  Nothing fancy.  The “polygraph” device is nothing more than your standard desktop computer connected to the polygraph accessories, which include an arm cuff and tubes.  I note the model number and company logo of the polygraph equipment which is Lafayette Instruments.  I would later go to their website and research their polygraph devices.  The CIA 3-day security process is just like a user posted here.  I spent 3 to 4 hours on both Day 1 and Day 2 being interrogated during the polygraph.  One day I’m accused of crime and the next day I’m accused of other stuff like being a spy.  Two conflicting accusations.  The funny thing is that after my first polygraph, I am told that I will be given the RARE chance to take another polygraph on the second day.  Rare?  Really?  My 3-day schedule had a nice intentional gap in my schedule, a perfect spot for some 3-4hr event, as if a polygraph appointment was meant to fit there.  I am on told on Day-2’s polygraph that like 80% of applicants are given the chance to take the polygraph again.  Ok, so my first polygrapher lied to me about the statistics?  Great.  The polygraph consists of standard Counterintelligence and Lifestyle questions, both sets which were reviewed with me before hand so I knew exactly what they would be asking. The question that everyone (whether you take a poly for the CIA, FBI, police, NSA, or other agency) is drilled on is something like “have you ever committed a crime for which you weren’t caught”.  This is a cover all question, as it applies to every other area that the polygraphers are concerned about.   So they want to see if you’ll admit to computer hacking, looking at porn at work, theft, pedophilia, killing someone, violence, drugs, etc.  Everyone gets grilled in this area.  If you have extensive overseas travel (like military people do), then you’ll also be grilled on foreign contacts and foreign intelligence during the counterintelligence portion of the poly.  The counterintelligence questions are something like:
-      Have you ever plotted to overthrow the US.
-      Have you ever had contact with a foreign agency
-      Do you have any financial stakes or property in a foreign country

The lifestyle questions may be something like:
-      have you ever committed a crime for which you weren’t caught?
-      Have you used illegal drugs that you have not told us about?
-      Did you intentionally falsify info on your application or security paperwork?
-      Have you discussed the hiring process with anyone, either in person or online? (yep, they may ask this!)

They will also want to know what you know about the polygraph, and what websites you visited.  They know about Antipolygraph.org, and they don’t like it.  The fact is, they assume that every applicant has done some research, so they want to see if you’ll be honest.  It is best to say that you researched the CIA hiring process, came across some polygraph information, and considered it garbage and chose not to use countermeasure techniques.

Well two months later I get a rejection letter in the mail.  Game over, thanks for playing.  I filed my FOIA request and stuff and filed an appeal, which I hear can take years.  Don’t expect too much from the CIA.
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Paste User Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #1 - Jun 25th, 2011 at 6:56am
Mark & Quote Quote 
Thanks for sharing your story. You mention, "They know about Antipolygraph.org, and they don’t like it." I'd be interested to know what you were told about this website. Also, were you shown a video before your polygraph? If so, do you recall what it said?
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George W. Maschke
E-mail: maschke@antipolygraph.org
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Postal mail: Van Trigtstraat 53, 2597 VX The Hague, The Netherlands
Personal Statement: "Too Hot of a Potato"

A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. -- Saul Bellow
WWW George W. Maschke  
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #2 - Jun 25th, 2011 at 11:22am
Mark & Quote Quote 
George W. Maschke wrote on Jun 25th, 2011 at 6:56am:
Thanks for sharing your story. You mention, "They know about Antipolygraph.org, and they don’t like it." I'd be interested to know what you were told about this website. Also, were you shown a video before your polygraph? If so, do you recall what it said?


Yes we did watch a video on the monitors in the applicant waiting area on Day 1 before our polygraphs.  I don't recall the details of the video, it was brief, like 15 minutes, but it was something similar to the phony NSA polygraph video that was floating around the internet years ago.  It tells us that the polygrapher is friendly, to just relax and follow instructions and everything will be fine.  Following the video, we had our "lab work" where they drew our blood and made us piss in cups and that stuff, then we were able to purchase small breakfast items from the mini-cafe.  Then the polygraphers came out into the applicant waiting room and called out their victims by name.  Little did I  know that my polygrapher was walking me the green mile.

They just asked "Have you researched the polygraph?  What websites did you visit?  What did you find out?"   And if you mention Antipolygraph.org, they make a note of it in your file.  This isn't an automatic disqualifier, but they have read everything on this site and they have plenty of applicants who come in and try to beat the poly using the CMs mentioned on here.  This is nothing new.  I'm sure the polygraphers polygraph each other during training and employ the CMs as practice, so they know what the CMs look like. 

I will also add that there is the "numbers test" before your poly starts.  The typical writing a number on a peice of paper and lie about what you wrote and the polygrapher will claim that he/she can read your lies like a book. The polygraph session last like 3-4 hours total (so it will be like sitting through two long boring movies), but the machine is only one for like 5 min at a time.  After the numbers pre-test, your first session is the set of counterintell questions for 5 minutes.  The machine goes off (but even though the session is finished you are still strapped and wired up and you are still being read and tested!).  The polygrapher fiddles with the computer.  Then the lifestyle questions for about 5 minutes, machine off.  And this repeats several times.  You'll be asked the same questions over and over and over.  The polygrapher will even leave the room at some point and return some 20 minutes later and start accusing you of crap.
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #3 - Jul 5th, 2011 at 1:39pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
I am just curious but did they say you were not suitable or did they say that your clearance was denied?  Did they ever start contacting your references?
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #4 - Oct 13th, 2011 at 11:08am
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Tongue

POLYGRAPHS ARE CONSIDERED ILLEGALAND A BREACH OF HUMAN RIGHTS IN ALL OF EUROPE SINCE 1954 THEY ARE NOT TO BE FOUND IN ANY COURT PROCEEDINGS OR VETTING FOR WHATEVER JOB APPLICATRION ALSO WE NOTE THAT HUMAN RIGHTS IS NOUGHT IKN THE USA WHICH IS WHY WE WILLNEVER EVEN CONSIDER VISITING AS YOU MIGHT BE SUDDENLY CONFRONTED BY SOME SHIT THAT IS OF NO INTEREST WHATEVER IN EUROPE.
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #5 - Oct 13th, 2011 at 7:37pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Quote:
POLYGRAPHS ARE CONSIDERED ILLEGALAND A BREACH OF HUMAN RIGHTS IN ALL OF EUROPE SINCE 1954 THEY ARE NOT TO BE FOUND IN ANY COURT PROCEEDINGS OR VETTING FOR WHATEVER JOB APPLICATRION ALSO WE NOTE THAT HUMAN RIGHTS IS NOUGHT IKN THE USA WHICH IS WHY WE WILLNEVER EVEN CONSIDER VISITING AS YOU MIGHT BE SUDDENLY CONFRONTED BY SOME SHIT THAT IS OF NO INTEREST WHATEVER IN EUROPE. 

I commend the societies that respect human and personal rights. But, please spare us the anti-American Euroweenie crap.
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #6 - Oct 14th, 2011 at 7:56pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
You may not be aware of polygraph use in Europe, check this link and become more educated about Europe and Polygraph.

http://books.google.com/books?id=Qp5oYrody-AC&pg=PA31&lpg=PA31&dq=european+polyg...
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #7 - Mar 26th, 2013 at 3:20pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Pretty much same as my experience in 2013
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #8 - Jun 7th, 2013 at 11:24am
Mark & Quote Quote 
Sounds very much like the crap I had to go through when I applied for the Agency's "summer intern program" in 1979.

I have no idea what my polygraph results were, since those are exempt from FOIA/PA disclosure.

I did learn from a FOIA/PA request I made to the Agency the results of my background investigation.  I now realize that it is little more than a popularity contest.
If more people interviewed by the investigators  "vote" for you than not, then you're in.  Otherwise, you're SOL.  Neither does it matter who the people are that they will talk to.  They'll meet with any piece of scum that claims to know you.
Fuck the Agency.  If your Office of Security minions and/or Agency polygraphers are reading this, I say again "Fuck the Agency".
You;'re absolutely right:  Don't expect zilch from the CIA.  Our country needs more Phillip Agees and Marks/Marchettis. Roll Eyes
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If any scum from the CIA Office of Security/Office of Personnel  or any pernicious Agency polygraphers are monitoring this site, I say to you incompetent jerks and worthless parasites:  MAY YOU FLUNK YOUR NEXT POLYGRAPH REVIEW AND GET OU(S)TED! 

"The only good spook is a DEAD spook!"  The best "tradecraft" is NO "tradecraft".  Our country cries out for its own citizenry to re-enact the events  of 25 January 1993.

Let's see more of those anonymous "memorial" stars gracing the hallowed halls of Langley! 

The only good polygraph machine is a SMASHED polygraph machine!

Let's see more Agency COS's follow the path of Buckley in Beirut!

Let's hope that all the "brave" Milan kidnappers get themselves extraordinarily renditioned back to Italy, to serve the sentences that they received in absentia from the Italian courts!  Let's see the name of the Agency credit card spendthrift NCS streetwalker/kidnapper "Monica Courtney Adler" appear with a star on the sacred wall of death at Langley!
 
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #9 - Aug 8th, 2013 at 6:38am
Mark & Quote Quote 
yanno, I'm wondering, as I suggested before, and this is only an assumption, but, I'm sure, they use polygraphs to disqualify candidates b/c they need to hire a certain percentage of minorities, however, they do grant you the opportunity of applying, spending your money to make the trip, stay in hotels/motels, etc.  (I'm talking about law enforcement here), but I cannot help but wonder, if your political affiliation might have anything to do with it as well, since in today's world, many people define themselves by their political affliliation.

I'm convinced if your leaders are corrupt, so will your people be, and believe we have come to this point...we all know how polygraph examiners work, and that polygraphs are not lie dectectors at all, so why use them?  To me, through polygraphs, they can pick and choose, otherwise, why would they use them?

I mean, all people working in the higher ranks of any department you apply with, must know they are a complete fraud, so, why continue to use them?

Is it b/c the examiner's community has managed to keep this all a secret, for so long that a whole lot of people still believe they are accurate?

Also, remember, if they were to discontinue polygraphs in all these agencies, a whole lot of examiners would be out of jobs, and suffer unemployment, living above standard levels, making the pays they make, they'd all suffer great losses, wouldn't they.

People do not do things for one reason, but many, and I'm starting to believe this whole polygraph scam is just that, a big scam....that agencies have been able to keep quiet for a long time.

Also, adding, what I've seen the last two Presidents get away with over the years, I'm not surprised, this entire polygraph scam has gone on for so long.  I'm sorry, but looking at the facts, ya just gotta wonder, how corrupt everything is.  Right down to our police forces?  I don't know, but I'm beginning to become very skeptical.  The heads of these departments do know, I know they know, due to the experience my friend had.

I mean, think about it...if the CIA/FBI and all of law enforcement, employed their own polygraph examiners, trained them, etc...I'm certain, a whole lot more honest people would get in....

My friend was told he looked so good on paper, he had tons of great refrences, including people he worked with who were now working at the department he was applying with. 

Maybe I'm grasping at straws, perhaps I'm totally off base on all of this, I don't know, it just doesn't make sense....none of it?  I believe there is a much bigger and broader picture to take into account.  Roll Eyes



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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #10 - Aug 13th, 2013 at 1:18pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Sully wrote on Aug 8th, 2013 at 6:38am:
yanno, I'm wondering, as I suggested before, and this is only an assumption, but, I'm sure, they use polygraphs to disqualify candidates b/c they need to hire a certain percentage of minorities, however, they do grant you the opportunity of applying, spending your money to make the trip, stay in hotels/motels, etc.  (I'm talking about law enforcement here), but I cannot help but wonder, if your political affiliation might have anything to do with it as well, since in today's world, many people define themselves by their political affliliation.


Oh yeah.  And this country has taken a turn for the worst.  Check out these recent headlines:

https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2012-featured-story-...

https://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2012-featured-story-...

http://www.newsmax.com/US/san-antonio-gay-law/2013/07/31/id/518011

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-250_162-57598231/california-law-allows-transgender-s...

You can't make this stuff up people.  As a strong right-wing conservative (yes, I hate dykes and faggots), I at one point thought I would find a good career with other conservatives in the intelligence community, where we don't have to be politically correct.  Not anymore.  CIA has turned queer, just like their stupid gay ass polygraph (which I also failed for no reason).  Everything in the original post is true.  Same questions, same location of the polygraph building, same ruse, same "bad-polygrapher, dumb-polygrapher" routine.

Angry
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #11 - Aug 14th, 2013 at 8:15am
Mark & Quote Quote 
I am a conservative, however, I don't hate anyone, not even examiners, but will say, this corrupt way of passing/failing someone with polygraphs, seriously . 

Not just for my friend, but for the tons of people in here who have been honest and failed the poly.   I encourage you to keep writing, and sharing your stories...to expose this inhuman way of disqualifying candidates.  Talk about shody work ethics?   

Also, with all due respect...out there in the career world, we work with all kinds of human beings.  Work is one hell of a teacher/experience.  Teaches us to be respectful, to work together as a team, to build character, fairness and tolerance as well as, being objective.  Lets all remember that.   

Nothing about this world seems to be fair, and as time goes on, Americans seem to become more greedy & owning less respect for laws or doing what is right.   

1.  There is one huge factor, we as human beings forget, "just because someone thinks or believes differently, doesn't make them wrong and us right, or visa versa.

2.  No matter what you say, think or react to any given situation, affects so many other lives, in a negative or positive way.

I believe, we all need to step back, at times, chill, and then try to articulate ourselves in a polite and intellectual manner.  Doesn't mean you have to agree, but to judge others with hate, is to judge yourself. 

Let me tell you, there are always people that will judge that person who failed the poly, people as myself, who once believed in them, ruining not only lives but also, break up marriages. 

These are not just words I'm writing, so if any poly examiner is reading this, be assured, Karma does exist, and while I wish you no harm, when you hurt others in a negative way, at some point, it's going to come back and bite you but good. 

So, next time, you interrogate someone, play your games,  slamming your hands down, spitting in the examinees or believe you have the power to read body language, remember, you are not GOD!   You have made many mistakes, and you HAVE harmed a whole lot of people in a very negative way!   Harmful, not only to that human being, but to yourself.  You are no better then any other criminal out there.  Remember that, next time you go to bed and try falling asleep.    Thank you GM, Doug and all the others in here, who are trying to help. 

If nothing else, hold onto the fact that honesty does and will prevail in the end.   

Thank you for allowing me to vent, and my apologies to everyone who has suffered from failing a poly, what ever you do, do not allow it to define you.  Sometimes when you loose you win!

Oh, I saw a commercial the other day for a new show, contestents will be given a poly, if the machine shows they are telling the truth, they win!   Angry  REALLY!

Best Regards, Sully

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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #12 - Aug 23rd, 2013 at 5:36am
Mark & Quote Quote 
Here is another blog which gives the full details from his CIA polygraph experience, before his rejection, in early 2013.  Looks like it's the same sham routine as it has been for years.

http://claudecassagne1964.wordpress.com/2013/01/23/the-polygraph-test-cia-januar...
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #13 - Aug 25th, 2013 at 1:40pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Your experience roughly parallels mine, give or take a few changes in their "interview" process that have taken place since 1979.
What an incredible waste of time, all to end up with a single page rejection letter.
At least today the anti-drone movement has encouraged many peace activists, for the first time to bring their protest actions right to the gates of Langley.  Maybe someday they will have enough participants to disrupt the "HEROIC" work of the cowardly rearguard "fighters" of the CIA!
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If any scum from the CIA Office of Security/Office of Personnel  or any pernicious Agency polygraphers are monitoring this site, I say to you incompetent jerks and worthless parasites:  MAY YOU FLUNK YOUR NEXT POLYGRAPH REVIEW AND GET OU(S)TED! 

"The only good spook is a DEAD spook!"  The best "tradecraft" is NO "tradecraft".  Our country cries out for its own citizenry to re-enact the events  of 25 January 1993.

Let's see more of those anonymous "memorial" stars gracing the hallowed halls of Langley! 

The only good polygraph machine is a SMASHED polygraph machine!

Let's see more Agency COS's follow the path of Buckley in Beirut!

Let's hope that all the "brave" Milan kidnappers get themselves extraordinarily renditioned back to Italy, to serve the sentences that they received in absentia from the Italian courts!  Let's see the name of the Agency credit card spendthrift NCS streetwalker/kidnapper "Monica Courtney Adler" appear with a star on the sacred wall of death at Langley!
 
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Re: My CIA Polygraph Story
Reply #14 - Aug 25th, 2013 at 1:47pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Of course, one never knows if they were rejected specifically by the "Agency" due to polygraph results.

In my case, I believe that a very defective and unfortunate BI was largely to blame as well!
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If any scum from the CIA Office of Security/Office of Personnel  or any pernicious Agency polygraphers are monitoring this site, I say to you incompetent jerks and worthless parasites:  MAY YOU FLUNK YOUR NEXT POLYGRAPH REVIEW AND GET OU(S)TED! 

"The only good spook is a DEAD spook!"  The best "tradecraft" is NO "tradecraft".  Our country cries out for its own citizenry to re-enact the events  of 25 January 1993.

Let's see more of those anonymous "memorial" stars gracing the hallowed halls of Langley! 

The only good polygraph machine is a SMASHED polygraph machine!

Let's see more Agency COS's follow the path of Buckley in Beirut!

Let's hope that all the "brave" Milan kidnappers get themselves extraordinarily renditioned back to Italy, to serve the sentences that they received in absentia from the Italian courts!  Let's see the name of the Agency credit card spendthrift NCS streetwalker/kidnapper "Monica Courtney Adler" appear with a star on the sacred wall of death at Langley!
 
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