Before I respond to Daddy-O's post, I would note that he has provided an example of what is perhaps the most widespread counter-countermeasure:
simply attempting to deter countermeasure use by confidently (but falsely) claiming that polygraphers can reliably detect countermeasures. Daddy-O,
You write:
Quote:1) 20% of the posts seem to revolve around individuals who have been convicted of molesting children. The are not coming to learn about the polygraph, they are actively seeking ways to beat the polygraph so they can continue to MOLEST CHILDREN! Children who will go on to repeat this cycle.
Except for one instance of a
polygraph supporter posing as a child molestor, I recall only two posters on this board who have acknowledged having been convicted of a sex offense against a child. And I don't recall any posts by anyone "actively seeking ways to beat the polygraph so they can continue to molest children."
Quote:2) 20% of the posts revolve around people who are utterly confused about polygraph and by reading the TLBTLD are only lessing the effect of the questions that are to their benefit. These people are mistakely led to think that people in LAW ENFORCEMENT do not want anyone else hired and the cards are stacked against them and that they will be a false positive. A false positive which will serve as a scarlet letter procluding from all further employment.
It is hardly surprising that individuals who are confused about polygraphy would post questions. That is to be expected, and indeed, one of the key purposes of this message board is to provide answers to those with questions about polygraphy.
It is neither my position, nor AntiPolygraph.org's, that people in law enforcement do not want anyone else hired. However, as I have explained elsewhere, the polygraph process is indeed inherently biased against the truthful, because the more candidly one answers the "control" questions, and as a consequene experiences less stress when answering them, the more likely one is to fail. We don't argue that anyone taking a pre-employment polygraph examination is destined to fail, but the risk
is quite significant. Nor do we argue that a false positive is a scarlet letter that will preclude (note spelling) one from
all employment. However, a false positive outcome with one agency can most definitely have an adverse effect on one's ability to gain employment with others.
Quote:Departments and agencies do not share this information. IT IS ILLEGAL! People who apply for these jobs cast a wide net and if they are in the 3-5% false postive percent range they will still hook up with one of the several thousand other law enforcement agencies.
While agencies that rely on polygraph screening might not share polygraph results with private companies, they most certainly do share polygraph results amongst themselves. It is not illegal.
In addition, given polygraphy's lack of scientific underpinnings and the high polygraph failure rates associated with pre-employment polygraph screening (~50% in the FBI and LAPD, for example), your posited 3-5% false positive rate is almost certainly grossly understated.
Quote:3) 30% of the people who come to this site are those who have criminal behavior they are trying to hide. Criminal behavior which in my experience includes attempted murder, rape, armed robbery, and many cases of child molestation. All of which would not have come to light if not for polygraph. People who would have been sworn in and patrolled the streets today.
No doubt, some who visit AntiPolygraph.org have done something that would disqualify them from certain positions that require polygraph screening. Your conclusion that 30% of those who visit AntiPolygraph.org are trying to hide criminal behavior is entirely conjectural however. (More than 99% of visitors to this website never post on the message board.)
In any event, AntiPolygraph.org has made countermeasure information publicly available and free not to help liars beat the system, but to help honest, law-abiding persons protect themselves against the high risk of a false positive outcome that is associated with the pseudoscience of polygraphy. We cannot make this information available to those who legitimately need it without also making it available to everyone.
Quote:4) 20% are those who have nothing to hide but hear alleged horror stories about the polygraph. Being screamed at, tortured, etc. This doesn't happen! Most departments tape there tests for this reason and project oversight exists. After reading this, the person becomes scared and makes a giant leap of faith. They think there is only way to pass the testis to:
COMMIT CONTERMEASURES!!!!!
I am not aware that anyone here has claimed that they were tortured during a polygraph examination. The only allegations of physical pain being inflicted of which I am aware involve over-inflated pressure cuffs. And while it is not the norm, instances of polygraphers screaming at subjects
are documented. See, for example, the
public statement of Bill Roche.
For those facing a pre-employment polygraph "test," the risk of a false positive outcome is significant. Countermeasure use is a rational choice for reducing that risk. You speak of "committing" countermeasures as if it were a crime. It's not.
Quote:Unfortunately, they get caught. Instead of obtaining thier dream job the research has been their demise. People say CM's are not caught. They are caught VIRTUALLY ALL THE TIME. People that have nothing to hide are now disqualified.
No polygrapher has ever demonstrated any ability to detect countermeasures. When you say that countermeasures are caught "virtually all the time,"
you are lying -- falsely asserting that which you cannot possibly know.
If you truly believe that you can reliably detect polygraph countermeasures, then why not accept Dr. Richardson's
polygraph countermeasure challenge?
Quote:If you have nothing to hide, met the departments guidelines and tell the truth you will pass the polygraph.
Lies such as the foregoing will not fly anymore, Daddy-O. As the National Academy of Sciences has affirmed,
polygraph screening is completely invalid. Who do you think you're fooling?
Quote:The unknown 10% are the real scary part. What are their intentions? Are they using the information obtained on this site, through TLBTLD, and William's to try and obtain access to intelligence agencies.
As I alluded to earlier, neither you nor I know the motivations of more than 99% of those who visit AntiPolygraph.org. It is certainly possible that spies, saboteurs, terrorists, and other criminals will exploit information made available on this website to fool America's intelligence agencies. All the more reason not to rely on the polygraph.
As for your cowardly attack on my patriotism and insinuation that I am some kind of foreign agent,
shame on you.
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Polygraph Counter-countermeasure Techniques (Read 149203 times)
