I work for another agency in the IC, but since I am on location at CIA headquarters, I must pass the CIA clearance as well to get 'detailee status.'
I was very stressed/traumitized following the 2 days of poly tests, but after reading this site I feel so foolish. I went in thinking this was going to be a piece of cake, because I had never done anything wrong in my life... or so I thought.
Here's my story
During the intial screening in which the polygrapher asked If I needed to add anything I didnt mention onmy forms, basically to come clean about anything, I mentioned I once took a perscription med which was not mine for it's intended use, he says no big deal.
post actual test, he says I failed the drug portion. So I come clean and tell him I actually took this perscription with alcohol one time. Mind you this is the only incident in my life I've done any type of drug, or misused a perscription.
Other questions are asked, we get through in about 2.5 hours.
day 1 summary:
polygrapher is VERY rude through out the test. accuses me of using "counter measures," and threatens to stop the test. Mind you, I have no clue what he's even talking about, but my allergies were really bothering me that day.
day 2
This polygrapher seems nicer intially, but little did I know that later he would become the same rude hardass as the previous polygrapher the day before.
Other than my non 100% truthful answer I discussed, I have absolutley nothing to hide in terms of anything I or they would consider major.
Several test are administered. The polygrapher seems to be convinced I am in touch with another governments intel agency. I assure him I'm not, and we eventually move on.
Here's were it gets really hard on me. He tells me there is deception concerning my "have you commited a major crime" question. That's absurd, of course not I think to myself. He on the other hand is not having it.
He continually grills me, saying I am lieing, saying I knew I would lie the moment I walked in, and that he doesn't believe a word I say because I was not 100% truthful regarding the perscription sleeping pill incident. He threatens to have me arrested for falsifying government documents.
I am a fairly tough guy both mentally and physically, but I am on the verge of tears here. After about an hour in which I kept stating I had no other issues to admit, he finally stated the test would be reported 'unresolved.' This was after I told him virtually everything I had done in my life that I could think of that could result in deception on my test.
Summary:
I felt very violated, and VERY ANGRY by their unproffesional practices. My Psyche was damaged for a couple days because they basically made me feel that because I mixed a sleeping pill with beer once, and didnt feel comfortable enough to tell them intially, that I had no intergrity. After living a clean,moral lifestyle my entire life, this was very troubling. The guy even had me worried I would now loose my job and TS/SCI clearance I already hold with another agency. Maybe I will, I'm not sure and am still worried about this a little.
I just wanted to share my experience, and it's nice to see I'm not the only one who has been troubled by these interviews.
49 views and no replies. I'd really like to get some thoughts. I feel like I failed the test, but Id still like to hear some thoughts
IC_employee,
A failed polygraph may affect your current TS/SCI; the
risks are not worth the rewards. At any rate, a failed
polygraph will follow you, where ever you go. You
should never ask, if you passed, or failed - they will
assume that you believe you failed...
I am sorry that you had to go through this experience. I think that if someone mentions something to the polygrapher on the onset "to come clean", they are pretty much doomed from the start. Personally, before I took the polygraph, the polygrapher asked me if I wanted to come clean about something, and I told him that I want to add a job on my application - one which I failed to mention - but not deliberately. I "came clean" about the job because initially, I thought that because I've only worked in it for about 1 month - pre college, that I didn't have to put it down. But then I remembered that they finger printed me, and so I informed the polygrapher - but not because I had anything to hide - I left that job because I hated it and because I could - I was a young kid living with my parents -nothing else. But of course, the polygrapher made it seem as if there was a huge story behind it, although we didn't dwell much on it - only 5 minutes.
or so I thought..
Well, lo and behold, at the end of the exam, the polygrapher said that I was having a problem with the drug usage question, and I told him that I don't know what he's referring to. He then told me that the same way I ommitted the job could possibly be the same way that I am ommitting the drug usage. I told him that I grew up religious (although I didn't mention the denomination), and he just looked at me like, "yeah, eveyone tells me the same thing".
I'll give him this much - at least he didn't accuse me of lying directly and our post interrogation didn't last for more than 10 minutes, but he did say that there was definitely a problem with the drug usage question. In any case, at the end, he said, "well, I'll attach a statement to your charts, but it don't look too good".
by the way, did he tell you directly if you failed or not? Is there anyone you can call to confirm?
well, in this case the status quo is that it does not effect my currect clearance. In fact, the last 4 people in my office who were designated to obtain the same clearance as me were rejected, and simply assigned to a different location. so I'm 99 % sure that's what will happen to me.
Quote from: Johnn on Sep 12, 2005, 05:02 PMby the way, did he tell you directly if you failed or not? Is there anyone you can call to confirm?
I asked him If I failed, and he said he does not make that determination.
I would just like to reiterate that I realize what I did in regard to not being 100% truthful on something that would have otherwise been trivial. The point of my post was these 2 session really made me question our government and their morality. It really shook me up
Quote from: IC_employee on Sep 12, 2005, 05:06 PM
I asked him If I failed, and he said he does not make that determination.
I would just like to reiterate that I realize what I did in regard to not being 100% truthful on something that would have otherwise been trivial. The point of my post was these 2 session really made me question our government and their morality. It really shook me up
Oh believe me, I completely understand - and I only had one three hour session. I never thought that I'd be accused of something as drug usage. As a matter of fact, I was hoping to be out of there in 1 hour, because I've never done anything to the effects of the things in the application in my life. The national security is definitely not an issue for me, drug usage - I grew up Mormon, so not even alchohol was I allowed to consume. So you can imagine how I now view those feebees and everyone else who adminsiters and accepts as scientific hard-core evidence, the polygrah.
IC employee,
If the CIA considered your admission about taking a prescription medication with alcohol to be disqualifying in and of itself, then you probably would not have been brought back for a follow-up polygraph session.
You may be interested in retired CIA agent Melissa Mahle's observations on the Agency's polygraph policy:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=2465.msg17432#msg17432
Former director James Woolsey has also called on the CIA to "radically curtail" its reliance on polygraphy:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=2414.msg17034#msg17034
A "tough guy" on the verge of tears because you can't clear a drug issue on a polygraph? Better stick to your Mr Mom job bud
Quote from: Eastwood on Sep 24, 2005, 01:24 AMA "tough guy" on the verge of tears because you can't clear a drug issue on a polygraph? Better stick to your Mr Mom job bud
Wow, Eastwood. You're SO cool, coming across as a total macho-macho-man here...
Quote from: Eastwood on Sep 24, 2005, 01:24 AMA "tough guy" on the verge of tears because you can't clear a drug issue on a polygraph? Better stick to your Mr Mom job bud
you're a classy guy.
I have no children, and I already have clearance with another agency. Nice try though sh!t head
Quote from: IC_employee on Sep 24, 2005, 11:10 PM
you're a classy guy.
I have no children, and I already have clearance with another agency. Nice try though sh!t head
Does the agency you are with now conduct polygraph tests?
Nonombre
they do not do life style polys, they only do counter intel
Quote from: IC_employee on Sep 26, 2005, 01:17 PMthey do not do life style polys, they only do counter intel
Maybe you can talk your current agency into doing the test on you if all they ask is "counter intel" questions. That would seem fair since you really belong to them anyway. Wouldn't that take care of the problem?
Nonombre
P.S. I am not a intelligence agency polygraph examiner, so forgive my ignorance, but what exactly are "counter-intel" questions? Is that like, "Are you trying to infiltrate my agency?"
???
Polygraphs are utterly worthless. I tried to get on with the FBI last summer as an investigative specialist.
I had three polys with them, all three were called inconclusive. I got the same rude, crude and socially unaccpetable treatment as you and others noted here.
I am very glad, (it's a God thing in my opinion), that I did not get the job. Over the past few years, I think that all of us have seen the incompetence and corruption that is all throughout the feds.
I know why I had an inconclusive test. I was the wrong age, wrong gender, wrong color. I did not fit the little profile they wanted that particular day.
It's their loss, not mine.
Kane:
You wrote that all of us have seen the corruption throughout the feds. Please enlighten me.
retcopper
I know you asked Kane but, I'm gonna add my 2 cents anyway.
Don't you read newapapers and watch TV? Or, when an article appears about a bad cop, do you play ostrich?
J. Edgar Hoover was a homo pervert who kept dossiers on all powerful politicians including presidents. This is how he got every damn thing he asked for from congress. He held the bad deeds they had done over their heads. I read this in a number of publications. This info was not published until after his death. The news media was afraid of him too. He and Lynden Johnson were buddies. Each had dirt on the other. Also, after his death, articles began to appear about the corruption of that organization. The CIA has had their share of bad press also. If these two agencies had shared their intellingence information there, in all likelyhood, would not have been the 9-11 horrow. All of the above stuff, and a lot more has been plastered all over the news media. It is not just my "anti police" attitude (as you put it). Where have you been man?
We have never gotten our money's worth from D. C. because of the corruption there. Look at the conspiratorial corruption between D. C. and the oil industry for which you, I and the rest of this country are paying dearly.
Retcopper,
Ever heard of Richard Hansen, Aldrich Ames, Ruby Ridge, Waco, or Oklahoma City?
How about the myraid of abuses that are reported in all sorts of news sources daily, from ATFE "raids", to IRS bullying, Janet Reno, and so on?
I am not saying that all federal employees are crooked. I know many federal employees and they are fine people.
However, the system as it currently stands is corrupt. It's about numbers and money. The more of a certain minority they hire, the better they look. The more they can say that "x" thing is wrong, the more tax money they can get.
Surely you can't be that totally devoted to the feds, can you?
Twoblock and Kane:
You guys are really grasping at straws to prove your "rampant corruption" allegation. If you had your way you probably would put drunk "Chappaquidick " Ted Kenedy in charge of the CIA and Janet "Wacko'' Reno in charge of the FBI. Two fine liberals, who by the way are also against the polygraph. Thank god that the CIA and the FBI work for us.
I had a meeting today with a ajudicator (sp)
This was actually very pleasant. I may have to go in for a 3rd poly. *ARGGGGH!! I feel like I am just repeating myself over and over again. apparently in their dictionary, "no" means ask the same question 8 more times.
Nonnombre: Since I am on location at CIA, I need to get their clearance. That's why i have to go through their clearance procedures.
retcopper
You asked to be enlightened however, you don't have the ability to be enlightened. Instead of trying to disprove what Kane and I wrote, you make a poor attempt at twisting things around. You need to go back to the Democrat's school of twisting. They are masters at it.
I see no need, as I'm sure is the case of the rest who visit this site, to respond your posts any more because you have proven that you can't debate the issues. So go ahead and have the last twist.
Quote from: Twoblock on Sep 30, 2005, 03:17 PMretcopper
You asked to be enlightened however, you don't have the ability to be enlightened. Instead of trying to disprove what Kane and I wrote, you make a poor attempt at twisting things around. You need to go back to the Democrat's school of twisting. They are masters at it.
I see no need, as I'm sure is the case of the rest who visit this site, to respond your posts any more because you have proven that you can't debate the issues. So go ahead and have the last twist.
Sometimes if you don't feed the trolls they go away on their own. Or starve to death.
Thus far "retcopper" has contributed nothing to this site except to read a post here and there and respond with the equivalent of "Oh, yeah?"
I have already mentioned this to him once in another thread, but apparently he is either unwilling or unable to come up with anything intelligent to say.
Sergeant:
If you are a real cop then you surely must have heard of the adage; "You lie wth dogs and you get fleas." Get my drift? You and I know that the majority of people that come to this site for one reason. I hope you can sleep well at night.
retcopper wrote:
QuoteSergeant:
If you are a real cop then you surely must have heard of the adage; "You lie wth dogs and you get fleas." Get my drift? You and I know that the majority of people that come to this site for one reason. I hope you can sleep well at night.
Oh, copper please enlighten those of us "criminals" who post on this site. Your narrow mindedness is quite stale. I would be willing to put my record against yours any day with the expectation that I am exceptionally "cleaner" than you. Your condescending attitude speaks volumes as you know nothing about the posters with the exception of your regular ASSumptions.
Surely, as a human you have heard the old adage "If it smells like shit, it probably is." I think you get MY drift.
Quote from: retcopper on Sep 30, 2005, 02:12 PMYou guys are really grasping at straws to prove your "rampant corruption" allegation.
Where I work there is a clear ethical standard:
Do what is best for the country, unless it conflicts with your own best interests, the financial interests of whatever company you work for, or will lessen your division's political power. Then talk about the importance of the mission, and how dedicated you personally are to it even though everyone else is messing up and just looking out for their own interests.
Watch the liberals here excoriate you for that one
Retcopper,
I see that you are still clueless.
I shudder in horror for the le agency that you work for or used to work for.
And the PTB in certain circles wonder why so many folks view le with a jaundiced eye.