Has anyone lied on a poly about a question and still passed the test? Just curious.
Many people have passed polygraphs while lying. For example, spies like Ignatz Theodor Griebl (http://antipolygraph.org/articles/article-027.shtml), Karel Frantisek Koecher (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=570.msg2932#msg2932), Larry Wu-tai Chin (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1445.msg11343#msg11343), Aldrich Hazen Ames (http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/polygraph/ames.html), and Ana Belen Montes (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=272.msg1295#msg1295) all passed the polygraph while lying about relevant issues. So, too, did Gary Ridgway (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1436.msg11312#msg11312), A.K.A. "The Green River Killer," the deadliest serial murderer in U.S. history.
Quote from: George W. Maschke on Jul 30, 2004, 02:29 PMMany people have passed polygraphs while lying. For example, spies like Ignatz Theodor Griebl (http://antipolygraph.org/articles/article-027.shtml), Karel Frantisek Koecher (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=570.msg2932#msg2932), Larry Wu-tai Chin (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1445.msg11343#msg11343), Aldrich Hazen Ames (http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/polygraph/ames.html), and Ana Belen Montes (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=272.msg1295#msg1295) all passed the polygraph while lying about relevant issues. So, too, did Gary Ridgway (https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=1436.msg11312#msg11312), A.K.A. "The Green River Killer," the deadliest serial murderer in U.S. history.
George,
One should note that most people that pass (and are not false negatives) are lying on the control questions. This is pretty much required to differentiate truth on the relevants.
-Marty
well, i meant personal experiences from average americans; not necessarily famous spies or serial killers.
Marty, I know that poly's with the CIA, NSA do not include control questions. I know this because my friend went through a poly and he was never asked a question like "do you ever lie to your love ones during his test. Wouldn't that make it much harder to pass while lieing? Also, what is a "false negative" on a poly?
Quote from: guest on Jul 30, 2004, 02:38 PMwell, i meant personal experiences from average americans; not necessarily famous spies or serial killers.
Guest,
One warning. If you choose to learn how the polygraph works, you may well increase the possibility of "failing" while being truthful absent countermeasures. The polygraph, especially the most common forms of it, depend on a bit of deception. For your own good of course. Like learning the trick behind a good magic act, the way you look at it will be unavoidably altered.
-Marty
Quote from: guest on Jul 30, 2004, 02:43 PMMarty, I know that poly's with the CIA, NSA do not include control questions. I know this because my friend went through a poly and he was never asked a question like "do you ever lie to your love ones during his test. Wouldn't that make it much harder to pass while lieing? Also, what is a "false negative" on a poly?
The R/I type (non-PLCQT and DLCQT) are older and considered quite inferior. However, they are probably a better choice (as poor as that is) when a person understands the deception involved with a PLCQT.
I have fewer qualms about these since they aren't intriniscally biased against the most honest - even if they are less reliable overall.
Also, since you indicate an interest in lying on a poly w/o "control questions" you are exactly the sort of person I hope the R/I works correctly on.
-Marty
I lied and passed. Read the "Polygraph is a fraud" thread in the post-conviction forum.
How many times do you have to bend over because of the polygraph? I never lied about what I did and stood up to take my licks for it. After being "consequenced" and "sanctioned" for being scored inconclusive and deceptive by charlatan polygraphers, I felt I needed to take proactive measures to protect myself from the polygraph clown show. On my last polygraph, I lied about having viewed pornography (saw some in junk/spam email). I used countermeasures and passed. After bending over backwards detailing every incidence of contact with minors, for example, and then being scored deceptive about having had sexual contact with anyone other than my wife, and then being punished for something I didn't even do, yeah, my attitude went south and it was time for a healthy F-you to the polygraph community.
Like many others who have been screwed by the polygraph - for whatever reason(s) one is having to take it in the first place - you can only begin to appreciate the fury of being judged a liar when you know goddamned well you told the friggin truth.