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Posted by GeorgeWood74
- Sep 19, 2019, 12:39 AMMy last time copy and pasting this. I just want to reach you as I personally understand your fear. Fist oof, its ok, you will be ok! Something my lawyer told me that really helped is " Don't beat yourself up, others are lined up to do that. You got a job to do and that is to be razor focused on your therapy!" If you do fail, they will often let you retake it after assessing the situation.
I am off probation now myself but can convey my experience to you. First off, you have paid your debt and it is a solid fact that sex offenses have the lowest recidivism rate of all crimes, especially with treatment. You need to stay focused on your treatment and or probation, everything you do can be of help to you or hurt you. Often they look at the big picture when assessing these matters. If you fail the polygraph but have clean slate otherwise and the chances are very low for you to be sent back to prison.
Only in a few states can you challenge the polygraph outright, what many of them do allow is for the scope of the questions to be limited. For instance, some states don't let them pry into things you were not charged with but, instead only if you are adhering to your probation.
When on probation I failed two polygraphs. One was a sexual history and the administrator made a general accusation, saying that I was hiding a hands on offense of some type. I was never accused or charged of that, and refused to admit to something I did not do and can't even imagine anything in my past to that even could be construed as such. It was never brought up again! I suspect it was a fishing expedition. From that point on I had to do a compliance check. In that one he showed me a little tiny bump on the readout, smirking and said you know what that means? "It means when I asked you if you have been viewing porn, you were deceptive." Well, I had not and more to the point the genius had also asked me in early questions if I had adhered to the terms of my probation and been honest with my probation officer. I asked him when he failed me on that single issue, if we were done as I was not going to admit to something I didn't do and he said "Yes, you are free to leave unless you want to make this right and tell the truth" I got up and left and called my probation officer and told him I failed, I did not wait, in fact if I farted and thought it could be an issue I called my probation officer throughout the duration of my probation because I wanted him to know that I rightfully respected / feared the situation. I asked him how I could be lying about viewing porn if the terms of my probation were that I not, and that I reported to him weekly and stated on paper I had not, AND I PASSED THOSE QUESTIONS (adhered to probation and been honest with my probation officer). He said it was a good point and they let it go.
The fist rule of probation is DON'T BRAKE THE RULES. The second rule is get vested in your future and make sure they know you are trying to get your life on track. When people do reoffend it is often when they are at a low point "fuck it" attitude and feel no hope or light at the end of the tunnel. If you go down that road, you will get hounded. If you are doing well and fail a polygraph, depending on the supervising agency they will try to be balanced. The third rule is, don't admit to or even suggest "attempt to appease" if you did not do anything wrong, but firmly and respectfully assert yourself. You can also consult an attorney after as well as before you take the polygraph.
Best of luck to you and I hope you get your life back on track and stay offense free...
I am off probation now myself but can convey my experience to you. First off, you have paid your debt and it is a solid fact that sex offenses have the lowest recidivism rate of all crimes, especially with treatment. You need to stay focused on your treatment and or probation, everything you do can be of help to you or hurt you. Often they look at the big picture when assessing these matters. If you fail the polygraph but have clean slate otherwise and the chances are very low for you to be sent back to prison.
Only in a few states can you challenge the polygraph outright, what many of them do allow is for the scope of the questions to be limited. For instance, some states don't let them pry into things you were not charged with but, instead only if you are adhering to your probation.
When on probation I failed two polygraphs. One was a sexual history and the administrator made a general accusation, saying that I was hiding a hands on offense of some type. I was never accused or charged of that, and refused to admit to something I did not do and can't even imagine anything in my past to that even could be construed as such. It was never brought up again! I suspect it was a fishing expedition. From that point on I had to do a compliance check. In that one he showed me a little tiny bump on the readout, smirking and said you know what that means? "It means when I asked you if you have been viewing porn, you were deceptive." Well, I had not and more to the point the genius had also asked me in early questions if I had adhered to the terms of my probation and been honest with my probation officer. I asked him when he failed me on that single issue, if we were done as I was not going to admit to something I didn't do and he said "Yes, you are free to leave unless you want to make this right and tell the truth" I got up and left and called my probation officer and told him I failed, I did not wait, in fact if I farted and thought it could be an issue I called my probation officer throughout the duration of my probation because I wanted him to know that I rightfully respected / feared the situation. I asked him how I could be lying about viewing porn if the terms of my probation were that I not, and that I reported to him weekly and stated on paper I had not, AND I PASSED THOSE QUESTIONS (adhered to probation and been honest with my probation officer). He said it was a good point and they let it go.
The fist rule of probation is DON'T BRAKE THE RULES. The second rule is get vested in your future and make sure they know you are trying to get your life on track. When people do reoffend it is often when they are at a low point "fuck it" attitude and feel no hope or light at the end of the tunnel. If you go down that road, you will get hounded. If you are doing well and fail a polygraph, depending on the supervising agency they will try to be balanced. The third rule is, don't admit to or even suggest "attempt to appease" if you did not do anything wrong, but firmly and respectfully assert yourself. You can also consult an attorney after as well as before you take the polygraph.
Best of luck to you and I hope you get your life back on track and stay offense free...
Posted by Ace
- Aug 08, 2019, 06:21 PMA few corrections for me to make; since I'm a guest and can't edit my post:
Quote from: 1D3F395C0 on Aug 08, 2019, 06:15 PM... takes advantage of a drunk adult who, due to being druke, plays along;...*****due to being drunk
Quote from: 1D3F395C0 on Aug 08, 2019, 06:15 PMlaw-abiding citizens who haven't hurt anyone in the future.*****who haven't hurt anyone; and probably won't in the future.
Posted by Ace
- Aug 08, 2019, 06:15 PMQuote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 20, 2012, 04:54 PM"im 19 and don't want to go to jail as a Sex Offender"
Best advice is: Don't commit sexual offenses and you won't be in jail. Your plight is normal for those in SOTP's nationwide. Should you be honest or should you lie? Ask your attorney, see what the ramifications are for both, and don't commit any sexual offenses in the future.
I know that Bill__Brown must mean well, but I honestly don't find anything productive in his seemingly hastily-formed answer.
Point being: SubStructure is already convicted for a sex offense; telling him not to commit another sex offense isn't going to prevent the danger that he might face once he goes back to jail for violating probation.
Point being: His (Bill__Brown's) post indicates that he likely has no experience of what a sex offender might really be; either because he isn't one or that plus he doesn't have a family member who is.
1. You don't have to actually commit a sex-offense to potentially be convicted of one (in the USA, and perhaps in other English-speaking western countries). There are so many cases where a "Sex offender" merely unintentionally brushed up on a child, and the parents became enraged. We have people who go to legal pornography tubesites who, unbeknownst to them, came upon a video of a porn actor who turned out to be underaged.
2. Many "sex offenders", while having broken a sex-offense law, are themselves victims of rashly-written, half-accurate unfair laws. The best example (in a nutshell) that comes to mind: an adult had consensual sex with a 14-year-old, while his country tells him that the 14-year-old can't legally consent. (Go to Italy, Germany, Portugal, Japan, Brazil, Argentina or Mexico, and it's all of the sudden legal.) Another example that comes to mind: a sexually adverturous teenager takes advantage of a drunk adult who, due to being druke, plays along; more than likely, it's the adult who ends up on the registy. (Logicality: the adult "should have known better.")
Many of us "sex offenders" are humanly innocent, socially decent people who not only don't have a prior criminal record, we are otherwise law-abiding citizens who haven't hurt anyone in the future.
So, respectfully, Bill__Brown, I hope you don't ever have the sharp nerve to tell us sex offenders that it's as easy as "simply not committing another offense in the future"; and that we ought to "correct [our] thinking errors".
(I don't doubt there are scumbag child predators who would get off raping a child without considering the child's well-being. There are lots of these imbeciles in this fucked-up world; hell, there maybe some of them on this board as we speak! But, then, there are those of us "sex offenders" who are nothing like that; hence what I described above.
Some victims will be in fact genuinely benefitted from the law. For others, the victims are the unfairly incarcerated. Simply realize that, like anything in this world, nothing is black and white; which includes the justice that sex offender laws were meant to serve.)
Posted by joker5968
- Mar 22, 2019, 12:21 PMhe was violated back to prison.
Posted by Joshua Ferris
- Mar 21, 2019, 08:29 AMAnyone know how the test went and if he passed or failed or told the truth or not?
Posted by Bill_Brown
- Aug 21, 2012, 05:19 PMExcellent post PooWhip
I am not aware of your circumstances and honestly; it's none of my business. I am not aware of Substructures circumstances and again; it's none of my business. Regarding convictions; I am aware that on occasion innocent persons are convicted of crimes they have not committed. Until your most recent post I was unaware that you profess to be innocent, my apologies.
I am also aware that all persons professing innocence are not in fact innocent. We are on a message board that protects individuals' privacy. I can only respond to what is posted by individuals. If we take personal responsibility for our thinking errors, we have a good chance of correcting them.
Best of luck to you sir.
I am not aware of your circumstances and honestly; it's none of my business. I am not aware of Substructures circumstances and again; it's none of my business. Regarding convictions; I am aware that on occasion innocent persons are convicted of crimes they have not committed. Until your most recent post I was unaware that you profess to be innocent, my apologies.
I am also aware that all persons professing innocence are not in fact innocent. We are on a message board that protects individuals' privacy. I can only respond to what is posted by individuals. If we take personal responsibility for our thinking errors, we have a good chance of correcting them.
Best of luck to you sir.
Posted by PooWhip
- Aug 21, 2012, 03:24 PMQuote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 21, 2012, 01:18 PMThe purpose of treatment is getting offenders to change the way they process information and respond appropriately.
I agree with this statement. However I am confused to why it was made.
I admit, that I am ignorant of the individuals guilt, conviction and all the facts of his case. I thought that I read the statement as a question on what to do as far as staying out of jail regarding the polygraph. Maybe you have more insight on this persons case and mind set. It would appear to be so. Either way, I do hope the person receives the proper help( if needed ). It also saddens me to hand such hypocritical advice.
Quote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 21, 2012, 01:18 PMAs one in treatment you seem to be stuck in your old methods of thinking.
Your assuming, that my old methods of thinking are impaired by those that are sexually deviant. You are mistaken.
It's a shame that most assume that those who have been convicted are always guilty. Perhaps painting with such a broad brush should be reconsidered.
Quote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 21, 2012, 01:18 PMWhy not just conform to the norms of society and correct the thinking errors.
The norms of society? That is another debate.
I would agree with the morality of man(right vs wrong) that one should try any means to correct their way of thinking in matters such as these.
It is mind boggling that you don't know me or my circumstance but you are confident in such bold and assuming statements towards me.
Question: Would you explain the attacks and obvious per-judged elements you have towards me and all those who have a convictions under their belt?
Quote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 21, 2012, 01:18 PMThere are consequences for violations of rules.
Thank you, for a moment the obvious had eluded me.
I have read multiple times on this site and others of the damning results that could come from such a thing as the polygraph test. My advice to the person seeking it, was not to stir a debate but to give said advice to the question at hand.
If the polygraph is truly a manipulative device, shouldn't those who are subject to it, do what they must knowing the chances of failing even if they are being honest. Regardless of convictions or other circumstances.
I had forgotten that they revoked my humanity card when I went to register on the sex offender list.
Posted by Bill_Brown
- Aug 21, 2012, 01:18 PMPooWhip,
The purpose of treatment is getting offenders to change the way they process information and respond appropriately. As one in treatment you seem to be stuck in your old methods of thinking. Why not just conform to the norms of society and correct the thinking errors. There are consequences for violations of rules.
The purpose of treatment is getting offenders to change the way they process information and respond appropriately. As one in treatment you seem to be stuck in your old methods of thinking. Why not just conform to the norms of society and correct the thinking errors. There are consequences for violations of rules.
Posted by PooWhip
- Aug 21, 2012, 12:25 AM[
That would be the best advice for a person who is not on the sex offender list.
However to those who are on the sex offender list, that would not be the most logical recourse. If you don't want to go to jail (self preservation)and if you have done something that may violate your probation. It could simply be something as little as being out side a minute or two after a nine o'clock curfew, or even seeing naked breast on the television by mistake. Also when it is prohibited without a computer nanny device and the judges permission to be on the internet ( especially on a community web site interacting on forums). That being said,.... DO NOT ADMIT TO ANYTHING EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO LIE. (If your are nervous because of making a sexual offense. I would suggest you do the RIGHT thing, as quickly as possible.)
Quote from: Bill_Brown on Aug 20, 2012, 04:54 PMBest advice is: Don't commit sexual offenses and you won't be in jail.Your plight is normal for those in SOTP's nationwide.Should you be honest or should you lie?Ask your attorney, see what the ramifications are for both, and don't commit any sexual offenses in the future.
That would be the best advice for a person who is not on the sex offender list.
However to those who are on the sex offender list, that would not be the most logical recourse. If you don't want to go to jail (self preservation)and if you have done something that may violate your probation. It could simply be something as little as being out side a minute or two after a nine o'clock curfew, or even seeing naked breast on the television by mistake. Also when it is prohibited without a computer nanny device and the judges permission to be on the internet ( especially on a community web site interacting on forums). That being said,.... DO NOT ADMIT TO ANYTHING EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO LIE. (If your are nervous because of making a sexual offense. I would suggest you do the RIGHT thing, as quickly as possible.)
Posted by Bill_Brown
- Aug 20, 2012, 04:54 PM"im 19 and don't want to go to jail as a Sex Offender"
Best advice is: Don't commit sexual offenses and you won't be in jail. Your plight is normal for those in SOTP's nationwide. Should you be honest or should you lie? Ask your attorney, see what the ramifications are for both, and don't commit any sexual offenses in the future.
Best advice is: Don't commit sexual offenses and you won't be in jail. Your plight is normal for those in SOTP's nationwide. Should you be honest or should you lie? Ask your attorney, see what the ramifications are for both, and don't commit any sexual offenses in the future.
Posted by PooWhip
- Aug 20, 2012, 06:27 AMQuoteIs it better to be honest and answer all questions even incriminating ones? or is it better to lie about certain things.
I use to be a firm believer in the justice system and I tried my best to pass that belief to my children. Until I had a legal problem of my own. trust me when I tell you. DO NOT ADMIT TO ANYTHING EVEN IF YOU HAVE TO LIE. I feel ashamed in giving that advice, but you must know that there is no justice in the court system. It is a game of dollars and cents, conviction ratings and elections. My apologies if my OPINION is offensive to anyone. I don't believe one can grasp the scope of my position unless they themselves have experienced an issue first hand. My personal issue is to heart wrenching to speak of, but back to the point. If you value your freedom over their career, then you will do the right (wrong) thing.
Goodluck
Posted by WacoOne
- Aug 15, 2012, 06:36 PMDon't over analyze it and above all don't admit to anything. They can only throw you in jail on actual violations (and they get those from admissions). If you're telling the truth, you might pass. Good luck.
Posted by stefano
- Aug 12, 2012, 06:33 PMI would recommend speaking to your lawyer prior to making any admissions which could incriminate you.
Posted by Substructure
- Aug 12, 2012, 01:20 PMI am on sex offender registration, and I am thoroughly terrified to take a polygraph. My lawyer says if I fail they cannot violate my probation, but that doesn't make any sense to me, maybe he hasn't elaborated enough. But if I pass by answering questions honestly, they can take anything as an admission, and screw me on something in the past or screw me on a violation of probation. It seems like a lose lose. Is it better to be honest and answer all questions even incriminating ones? or is it better to lie about certain things. I've read "The Lie Behind The Lie Detector" But I don't think my breathing is gonna get me out of this. I'm so fucking scared, im 19 and don't want to go to jail as a Sex Offender 