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A forum for free and open discussion of polygraph-related topics
Posted by Proud
- Mar 29, 2010, 11:56 AMNo, they just ask for discretion repeatedly. I won't list all of the questions or give hints about the brainbench tests or anything that could be used. I also haven't said anything that hasn't already been posted 100 times.
I still think they are probably mostly good people and have an important mission so I'm not here to jeapordize that. I simply hope that at some point they change some hiring practices so that they get the best people. Most psychology teachers have already said all of this when covering polys as well.
I think it is a win win in the final look because it turns out my wife doesn't want to move. Good to find out now before they wasted more time and resources.
I still think they are probably mostly good people and have an important mission so I'm not here to jeapordize that. I simply hope that at some point they change some hiring practices so that they get the best people. Most psychology teachers have already said all of this when covering polys as well.
I think it is a win win in the final look because it turns out my wife doesn't want to move. Good to find out now before they wasted more time and resources.
Posted by George W. Maschke
- Mar 26, 2010, 11:53 AManonymouse00,
Given the CIA's bad faith in the hiring process, epitomized by the fraudulent practice of polygraph screening (which involves the polygraph operator lying to and otherwise deceiving the person being "tested"), I don't think any applicant--especially one who has been falsely accused of deception--should feel any compunction about publicly discussing his or her experiences.
With regard to IP logs, yes, we know that AntiPolygraph.org is regularly visited from IP addresses belonging to government organizations that have polygraph programs.
Given the CIA's bad faith in the hiring process, epitomized by the fraudulent practice of polygraph screening (which involves the polygraph operator lying to and otherwise deceiving the person being "tested"), I don't think any applicant--especially one who has been falsely accused of deception--should feel any compunction about publicly discussing his or her experiences.
With regard to IP logs, yes, we know that AntiPolygraph.org is regularly visited from IP addresses belonging to government organizations that have polygraph programs.
Posted by anonymous00
- Mar 26, 2010, 10:29 AMQuote from: 4A68756F7E1A0 on Mar 24, 2010, 11:04 PM... A final interesting note. I mentioned these types of websites but that I had not studied the counter measures, which is true. That was probably a bad move since he became annoyed then. He wrote off these types of sites and told me that they have a "research team" reading this stuff all the time.
Is that not domestic spying? I did not think the CIA was allowed to do that, haha.
Umm, did you sign a Non-Disclosure saying that you wouldn't reveal any information regarding your process? And you know that they have people reading these websites. So now they can read what you posted and see that disclosed polygraph questions, thus, violating your Non-Disclosure agreement!
To the Admin of this site, question: Do your IP Address logs show hits from the governement agencies such as this one, visiting the site on a regular basis?
On another note, has anyone read this guy's story?
http://www.khalidelhassan.com/Polygraph__Hypnosis__Etc.html
Apparently it's all true. You can look up his case online, he included .pdf attachments of all his stuff throughout the website, and you can look up him and his domain name and verify anything. He mentions sleeping with a recruiter, and having his house broken into by agents. wild.
Posted by DippityShurff
- Mar 25, 2010, 05:30 PMQuote from: Twoblock on Mar 25, 2010, 05:13 AMProud
Our federal agencies have never played by other than their own rules. Weren't they involved, along with the FBI, in the illegal wiretap, of phone calls made by citizens of this country and corporate America under the guise of looking for suspected "terror people"? Hasn't the new Homeland Security Agency directive, left wing "terror people", labeled conservatives "right wing extremist"? What the current president is doing makes President Bush's illegal wiretap executive order look like a piker. Did Homeland Security people have to pass a polycrap? Hell NO.
I just read a short history of the CIA's dealing drugs and dealings with the Mob.
I'm glad you upheld your integrity. Integrety seems to be in short suppy in Washington, D.C.
FLIP THE CONGRESS!!!
DippityShurff good to see you post again.
Thank you Proud. Nice to be back in the saddle!
Posted by Twoblock
- Mar 25, 2010, 05:13 AMProud
Our federal agencies have never played by other than their own rules. Weren't they involved, along with the FBI, in the illegal wiretap, of phone calls made by citizens of this country and corporate America under the guise of looking for suspected "terror people"? Hasn't the new Homeland Security Agency directive, left wing "terror people", labeled conservatives "right wing extremist"? What the current president is doing makes President Bush's illegal wiretap executive order look like a piker. Did Homeland Security people have to pass a polycrap? Hell NO.
I just read a short history of the CIA's dealing drugs and dealings with the Mob.
I'm glad you upheld your integrity. Integrety seems to be in short suppy in Washington, D.C.
FLIP THE CONGRESS!!!
DippityShurff good to see you post again.
Our federal agencies have never played by other than their own rules. Weren't they involved, along with the FBI, in the illegal wiretap, of phone calls made by citizens of this country and corporate America under the guise of looking for suspected "terror people"? Hasn't the new Homeland Security Agency directive, left wing "terror people", labeled conservatives "right wing extremist"? What the current president is doing makes President Bush's illegal wiretap executive order look like a piker. Did Homeland Security people have to pass a polycrap? Hell NO.
I just read a short history of the CIA's dealing drugs and dealings with the Mob.
I'm glad you upheld your integrity. Integrety seems to be in short suppy in Washington, D.C.
FLIP THE CONGRESS!!!
DippityShurff good to see you post again.
Posted by Proud
- Mar 24, 2010, 11:04 PMThey actually called me back and asked me to reconsider later and pretty much admitted it was a mind game. I said no thanks. They called again later and told me I had to pay them the money back for the hotel room and car. I told them I was not given it back by the hotel and rental company and never signed anything saying I would pay them back if I terminated the process.
They went on about how they do this to everyone. My response was that maybe if they would quit only hiring people who are willing to be treated like that, the agency would not have so many problems.
Being treated like crap when you are 18 and joining the Army is one thing. But when you have a family and they act like they are going to mess with your career and insult you and you take it... to me, that is not a positive quality. Intelligent and confident people will stand up for themselves.
I did leave a few things out in my quick, somewhat tired post. The main thing is this: I had a question, "are you intentionally planning on lying to any question." I answered no. No deception indicated. But they said I lied on the same series of questions. I went through this three times and three times in a row, the same thing happened. I told him that did not make sense. It was a logical fallacy. If I knew the questions and was lying, and it said I was telling the truth on the question about lying- the machine does not work.
This made him very, very mad. He tried to ramble on and make an argument about how those are testing seperate things.
He was also mad because he asked "have you ever taken advantage of someone?" I told him yes. My wife makes dinner for me sometimes and I don't thank her. Everyone takes advantage of people at some time. He told me that was not taking advantage and got mad. That is a fact. He told me to answer no. He got mad and said he had never taken advantage of his wife. If anyone has done any research into family dynamics or therapy, they would know that everyone takes advantage of someone at some time. Jesus knew that Judas would betray him and yet he let him, which caused him to kill himself. Jesus could have stoppped this, but did not. Even if it is ultimately for a good reason- did Jesus not take advantage? Strictly speaking, yes, he did. So, this polygrapher is better than Jesus...
Even though I believed that yes, I do take advantage of people and answered that I do not- no deception indicated. LOL! That is great!
So, when asked if I will lie I say no and am not lying but then I lie. I must have the memory of a fish since he told me what he was going to ask and I forgot that I was going to lie! At the same time when I know I am lying as I was asked to do, it says I am telling the truth.
A final interesting note. I mentioned these types of websites but that I had not studied the counter measures, which is true. That was probably a bad move since he became annoyed then. He wrote off these types of sites and told me that they have a "research team" reading this stuff all the time.
Is that not domestic spying? I did not think the CIA was allowed to do that, haha.
They went on about how they do this to everyone. My response was that maybe if they would quit only hiring people who are willing to be treated like that, the agency would not have so many problems.
Being treated like crap when you are 18 and joining the Army is one thing. But when you have a family and they act like they are going to mess with your career and insult you and you take it... to me, that is not a positive quality. Intelligent and confident people will stand up for themselves.
I did leave a few things out in my quick, somewhat tired post. The main thing is this: I had a question, "are you intentionally planning on lying to any question." I answered no. No deception indicated. But they said I lied on the same series of questions. I went through this three times and three times in a row, the same thing happened. I told him that did not make sense. It was a logical fallacy. If I knew the questions and was lying, and it said I was telling the truth on the question about lying- the machine does not work.
This made him very, very mad. He tried to ramble on and make an argument about how those are testing seperate things.
He was also mad because he asked "have you ever taken advantage of someone?" I told him yes. My wife makes dinner for me sometimes and I don't thank her. Everyone takes advantage of people at some time. He told me that was not taking advantage and got mad. That is a fact. He told me to answer no. He got mad and said he had never taken advantage of his wife. If anyone has done any research into family dynamics or therapy, they would know that everyone takes advantage of someone at some time. Jesus knew that Judas would betray him and yet he let him, which caused him to kill himself. Jesus could have stoppped this, but did not. Even if it is ultimately for a good reason- did Jesus not take advantage? Strictly speaking, yes, he did. So, this polygrapher is better than Jesus...
Even though I believed that yes, I do take advantage of people and answered that I do not- no deception indicated. LOL! That is great!
So, when asked if I will lie I say no and am not lying but then I lie. I must have the memory of a fish since he told me what he was going to ask and I forgot that I was going to lie! At the same time when I know I am lying as I was asked to do, it says I am telling the truth.
A final interesting note. I mentioned these types of websites but that I had not studied the counter measures, which is true. That was probably a bad move since he became annoyed then. He wrote off these types of sites and told me that they have a "research team" reading this stuff all the time.
Is that not domestic spying? I did not think the CIA was allowed to do that, haha.
Posted by DippityShurff
- Mar 24, 2010, 06:57 PMI have no doubt that you could have contributed in a very significant way to the CIA, or any other field of endeavor you choose. It is their loss, and in my opinion, until Agencies quit relying on this quack-science and start doing exhaustive and expensive background checks, good citizens like yourself will continue to fall through the cracks.
Posted by Gil
- Mar 24, 2010, 11:59 AMThank you, Proud for your service and sorry for your bad experience. It's their loss.
Posted by George W. Maschke
- Mar 23, 2010, 02:15 PMCongratulations on finishing up your graduate studies, and on on refusing to put up with the CIA's dishonest and dishonorable treatment of applicants and employees.
And thank you for sharing your experience here. When you get back to campus, you might also consider helping out with AntiPolygraph.org's poster initiative:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=872.msg5920#msg5920
By helping to publicly dispel the myth of the lie detector, we hasten its (long overdue) abolishment.
And thank you for sharing your experience here. When you get back to campus, you might also consider helping out with AntiPolygraph.org's poster initiative:
https://antipolygraph.org/forum/index.php?topic=872.msg5920#msg5920
By helping to publicly dispel the myth of the lie detector, we hasten its (long overdue) abolishment.
Posted by Proud
- Mar 22, 2010, 09:58 PMSo, I am graduating from a top ten grad school in my field and thought it would be fun to work for the CIA. So I came up to DC, visited and saw how expensive the area is... but thought it might be worth it.
Until today. I admitted to past drug use and everything else I had done. I am a decorated Iraq vet, a member of the church, and I spend my extra time (when not playing with my 2 year old) volunteering for the homeless.
Still, according to the poly, I somehow have time to do drugs (within the past two years) and even was accused of being a Mexican drug runner (I'm a short white, blonde guy with "grad school gut")... I just got out of the Army Reserve and basically am a pretty good guy. My only vice is the occasional beer and some small bets on football and the bball tournament... No drugs. I actually got myself in trouble when he accused me of doing drugs and I laughed... and when retested, he told me I was still lying... so I told him this was a joke. They invited me back but I decided tonight I am not going and being accused of this again. I volunteered for over 100 combat missions and hit a roadside bomb... I have earned my respect. And I still have a good job.
I am sure it was a mind game and I would have been fine going back tomorrow. but I don't feel like moving across the country to work for a place that treats me like that. Too bad, for the CIA. I could have contributed.
I did pray last night that God give me a sign if I was in the right place. He answered.
Until today. I admitted to past drug use and everything else I had done. I am a decorated Iraq vet, a member of the church, and I spend my extra time (when not playing with my 2 year old) volunteering for the homeless.
Still, according to the poly, I somehow have time to do drugs (within the past two years) and even was accused of being a Mexican drug runner (I'm a short white, blonde guy with "grad school gut")... I just got out of the Army Reserve and basically am a pretty good guy. My only vice is the occasional beer and some small bets on football and the bball tournament... No drugs. I actually got myself in trouble when he accused me of doing drugs and I laughed... and when retested, he told me I was still lying... so I told him this was a joke. They invited me back but I decided tonight I am not going and being accused of this again. I volunteered for over 100 combat missions and hit a roadside bomb... I have earned my respect. And I still have a good job.
I am sure it was a mind game and I would have been fine going back tomorrow. but I don't feel like moving across the country to work for a place that treats me like that. Too bad, for the CIA. I could have contributed.
I did pray last night that God give me a sign if I was in the right place. He answered.