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Posted by curiousman
- Oct 24, 2008, 05:53 PMI have been concerned about this question for a long time. I'm also naturalized citizen, born in Uzbekistan.
Mine is different situation though. Because, I'm the only one who is living in the US, and holding US citizenship.
I'm planning to work in Intelligence field after I get out of military(USMC).
Is there anyone who can share his views?
Mine is different situation though. Because, I'm the only one who is living in the US, and holding US citizenship.
I'm planning to work in Intelligence field after I get out of military(USMC).
Is there anyone who can share his views?
Posted by curious_george009
- May 24, 2006, 02:21 AMThanks for the replies.
Posted by Wallerstein
- May 02, 2006, 03:51 PMIt is not necessarily a "clearance killer." Someone told me at CIA that an Arab born in the middle east got through--after 2 years but he did get through. I know that a naturalized citizen got into foreign service at State.
This is all anecdotal, but it does prove that (a) being naturalized is not a clearance killer and (b) having relatives abroad is not a clearance killer. It just means it will take longer.
What would definitely be a clearance problem is if you express any loyalty WHATSOEVER to your country of birth, have used your old passport since becoming a U.S. citizen, or relatives abroad work in security-government-intelligence positions.
Don't adjudicate yourself out...
This is all anecdotal, but it does prove that (a) being naturalized is not a clearance killer and (b) having relatives abroad is not a clearance killer. It just means it will take longer.
What would definitely be a clearance problem is if you express any loyalty WHATSOEVER to your country of birth, have used your old passport since becoming a U.S. citizen, or relatives abroad work in security-government-intelligence positions.
Don't adjudicate yourself out...
Posted by curious_george009
- May 02, 2006, 01:48 PMI will check out vault.
Also, the native country is not hostile to the US and not of any strategic importance.
From what I understand, people are never denied clearance at CIA and NSA based on security decisions but rather on suitabiltiy grounds. Therefore, the decisions are never open to appeal.
From what I have heard - the security personnel considers the whole person concept but from a lot of the security decisions I've read online for industrial clearances, the DSS denied a lot of people clearances based on the foreign influence issue. Some of these negative decisions were later overturned on appeal. However, if the original decisionmaking process is indicative of security personnel across the board (DSS, CIA, NSA, etc). then a reasonable assumption would be that having relatives abroad is, as one person here said, "a clearance killer". Furthermore, if these negative security decisions are put under the unsuitability umbrella at the CIA then the decision cannot be appealed like it would be in the industrial clearance categories.
So, the long and short of it - It would be nice to get some kind of emperical evidence that a naturalized citizen with foreign national relatives did indeed make it through the clearance process successfully. However, I suspect that that would be hard to find online, perhaps because those who have been cleared are no longer reading this board or the one on vault.
Also, the native country is not hostile to the US and not of any strategic importance.
From what I understand, people are never denied clearance at CIA and NSA based on security decisions but rather on suitabiltiy grounds. Therefore, the decisions are never open to appeal.
From what I have heard - the security personnel considers the whole person concept but from a lot of the security decisions I've read online for industrial clearances, the DSS denied a lot of people clearances based on the foreign influence issue. Some of these negative decisions were later overturned on appeal. However, if the original decisionmaking process is indicative of security personnel across the board (DSS, CIA, NSA, etc). then a reasonable assumption would be that having relatives abroad is, as one person here said, "a clearance killer". Furthermore, if these negative security decisions are put under the unsuitability umbrella at the CIA then the decision cannot be appealed like it would be in the industrial clearance categories.
So, the long and short of it - It would be nice to get some kind of emperical evidence that a naturalized citizen with foreign national relatives did indeed make it through the clearance process successfully. However, I suspect that that would be hard to find online, perhaps because those who have been cleared are no longer reading this board or the one on vault.
Posted by Wallerstein
- May 02, 2006, 01:25 PMCheck out the message board for CIA at vault.com they have good info there.
"Unsuitable" determinations are not open to appeal. Security decisions are.
Re family members it all depends on WHICH country you are talking about. China will cause the most problems...also Russia, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.
"Unsuitable" determinations are not open to appeal. Security decisions are.
Re family members it all depends on WHICH country you are talking about. China will cause the most problems...also Russia, Cuba, Vietnam, etc.
Posted by curious_george009
- May 02, 2006, 01:10 PMI have relatives (extended family) abroad. The contact is casual and infrequent.
Also, anyone have insights into the CIA's or NSA's adjudicative process? What I know so dar is that the decision cannot be appealed.
Also, anyone have insights into the CIA's or NSA's adjudicative process? What I know so dar is that the decision cannot be appealed.
Posted by yorkie
- May 02, 2006, 12:15 PMThis depends on whether they are nuclear or extended family, and, moreover, the scope of your contact with them.
Posted by curious_george009
- May 02, 2006, 04:40 AMHi All.
I was wondering if anyone here knows if US naturalized citizens (with foreign national relatives - some living in the US and some in the native country) have been granted a security clearance by either the NSA or CIA in recent years.
That is to say, passed the poly, made it through adjudication, and received an entry on duty date.
I was wondering if anyone here knows if US naturalized citizens (with foreign national relatives - some living in the US and some in the native country) have been granted a security clearance by either the NSA or CIA in recent years.
That is to say, passed the poly, made it through adjudication, and received an entry on duty date.