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Posted by Deputydog
- Jun 30, 2005, 08:43 PMIf the prints are in AFIS, you will stand a big chance of getting caught. They can run the prints on an ID search and wait for a hit. The prints will most certainly show up in the system. We ID turds like that all the time when we don't beleive they ARE who they say they are. However, if the prints are ink/paper, there's probably no way to track it unless they want to do a lot of leg work.
Most of the time they would put in an inquiry to several surrounding agencies for recent application info on you within about the last 3 years. I know a couple of people that applied 10 years previously with ink prints to the same agency and never admitted to it and were hired. After that long it all ends up in archives or just disposed of.
The more interesting thing is, there is really only one reason that you don't want to admit to other apps, and that is that you intend on changing a disqualifying factor on the new apps. This is exactly why the BIs check it out. I'm sorry, I'm not buying the story about why you were DQed. Even if it is true, that would not be a disqualifying factor at another agency. Thus, no reason to not admit it. ME thinks there's something else!!!
Most of the time they would put in an inquiry to several surrounding agencies for recent application info on you within about the last 3 years. I know a couple of people that applied 10 years previously with ink prints to the same agency and never admitted to it and were hired. After that long it all ends up in archives or just disposed of.
The more interesting thing is, there is really only one reason that you don't want to admit to other apps, and that is that you intend on changing a disqualifying factor on the new apps. This is exactly why the BIs check it out. I'm sorry, I'm not buying the story about why you were DQed. Even if it is true, that would not be a disqualifying factor at another agency. Thus, no reason to not admit it. ME thinks there's something else!!!
Posted by dimas
- Jun 25, 2005, 04:49 PMJust because you didn't put it on there doesn't mean that they didn't pick it up, or maybe they missed it or maybe they didn't care. Each department is different. Some really don't give a hoot who you have applied with. The very first department I started with
practically hired anyone as long as there was no NCIC criminal history and the 5 references the applicant provided and his previous employer gave a good reference. Fortunately the State jumped in and began to require a thorough background check and random drug tests. My previous department was one of those in which if you passed their background, psychological and their polygraph then you were "in", regardless of whether or not other departments hired or fired you or if you applied for some agencies you did not reveal on your packet. The one I am in now is somewhat different in that matter and runs a very thorough background investigation.
Each agency is governed by a different human resources department, different City, County or State ordinances which govern the hiring process.
The simple fact is that if you lie/omit or "forget" you run the risk of not getting the job. That is an individual choice, but if you are already lying to get the job I can only imagine what kind of officer you will be when you get out on the streets.
practically hired anyone as long as there was no NCIC criminal history and the 5 references the applicant provided and his previous employer gave a good reference. Fortunately the State jumped in and began to require a thorough background check and random drug tests. My previous department was one of those in which if you passed their background, psychological and their polygraph then you were "in", regardless of whether or not other departments hired or fired you or if you applied for some agencies you did not reveal on your packet. The one I am in now is somewhat different in that matter and runs a very thorough background investigation.
Each agency is governed by a different human resources department, different City, County or State ordinances which govern the hiring process.
The simple fact is that if you lie/omit or "forget" you run the risk of not getting the job. That is an individual choice, but if you are already lying to get the job I can only imagine what kind of officer you will be when you get out on the streets.
Posted by gladtobeworking
- Jun 23, 2005, 09:09 PMthis is false. i applyed with several agencies, was fingerprinted with several agencies, never put all them on my apps and i still got a job so dont belive that it follows you around and yes it was a live scan. and if they do catch you hey you forgot it was a long time ago
Posted by alice
- Apr 14, 2005, 01:17 PMUnsure as to where this question goes..but I just applied for a job with the Phoenix PD . Is there anyone on the board that is with Phoenix?
I applied to work in the crime lab as I have forensics and chemistry degree.
I already passed poly and background is going well along with my physical ..just letting my BI do his job..
Also..this is not a recruitment site to be sure..but if anyone knows of any lab in their LE agency that is looking for Criminalist or Crime Scene techs..would apply there also.
thank you..
Alice
I applied to work in the crime lab as I have forensics and chemistry degree.
I already passed poly and background is going well along with my physical ..just letting my BI do his job..
Also..this is not a recruitment site to be sure..but if anyone knows of any lab in their LE agency that is looking for Criminalist or Crime Scene techs..would apply there also.
thank you..
Alice
Posted by alice
- Mar 29, 2005, 12:30 AMDimas,
I applied to an agency for an internship and they took a paw print so is that what I say on my background packet ....that I applied for an internship in their lab.
I applied to an agency for an internship and they took a paw print so is that what I say on my background packet ....that I applied for an internship in their lab.
Posted by dimas
- Jul 12, 2004, 06:16 AMOK fellas, here goes for EVERYONE to understand. Lying on a background packet or to a potential LE employer will get you nowhere and looks very poorly on your character. You are going to be enforcing the laws! when our children are in trouble we tell them to wait for or go to a POLICEMAN for help. How many of us want our kids running to a cop with no integrity?
Now, while many of you may not get caught due to omission, many of you will get caught and I hope ALL of you get caught.
There are other ways to find out where you applied other than getting a list of people that have checked your finger prints on AFIS. When an agency checks your credit it comes up on your credit report, an agency may request your IRS tax information for the last 3 years and find out who else requested it. But most importantly they find out because other people tell them, be it past employers, your friends, parents or spouse; someone will let it slip that you applied to this or that agency and they will find out.
Bottom line, stop trying to hide things, try the honest approach if it doesn't work keep trying again and again, eventually you will get hired somewhere. I speak from experience so please take my advice.
Now, while many of you may not get caught due to omission, many of you will get caught and I hope ALL of you get caught.
There are other ways to find out where you applied other than getting a list of people that have checked your finger prints on AFIS. When an agency checks your credit it comes up on your credit report, an agency may request your IRS tax information for the last 3 years and find out who else requested it. But most importantly they find out because other people tell them, be it past employers, your friends, parents or spouse; someone will let it slip that you applied to this or that agency and they will find out.
Bottom line, stop trying to hide things, try the honest approach if it doesn't work keep trying again and again, eventually you will get hired somewhere. I speak from experience so please take my advice.
Posted by Brandon
- Jul 11, 2004, 07:18 AMWhat if you applied to an agency and was dq'd but not fingerprinted?
Posted by luke272
- May 18, 2004, 07:41 PMBottom line here is that you had to admit to applying to another department after you conveniently "forgot" to put it down on your application. Was it worth "forgetting" and then having to do a tap dance for the BI afterwards? I doubt it. Wouldn't it have just been easier to tell the truth, and not have to do all the explaining after the fact? With another BI at a different police department, you very well could have been DQ'ed on the spot for that "omission."
You are right. It was not worth it at all. I never said it was. I could have been DQ'd on the spot but luckily I wasn't. It was a bad move, that is why I'm trying to help out and tell this guy not to try to lie. If you lie about applying to another agency and you WERE fingerprinted you will get caught. BOTTOM LINE. Good luck.
You are right. It was not worth it at all. I never said it was. I could have been DQ'd on the spot but luckily I wasn't. It was a bad move, that is why I'm trying to help out and tell this guy not to try to lie. If you lie about applying to another agency and you WERE fingerprinted you will get caught. BOTTOM LINE. Good luck.
Posted by Kona
- May 18, 2004, 07:24 AMQuote from: spruceland on May 18, 2004, 04:41 AMI received a conditional offer of employment around 5-6 times. I actually smile and throw that letter in my drawer when it comes in the mail because there's always something that messes it up. I call it the "Al Bundy" syndrome.
Did you ever follow up on any of these conditional offers of employment, or did you just blow them off? After you've been given a conditional offer, usually the only things that can mess things up are the psychological exam or the physical exam. What happened?
Quote from: spruceland on May 18, 2004, 04:41 AMI am really hoping you guys are wrong and am thinking about chancing it, OR waiting a couple of years and earning my MBA and then applying and explaining. I guess I have a decision to make.
You can hope all you want, but I'm going on the record here that if you "forget" to list your prior police dept applications, you will get caught in a lie/omission and be DQ'ed.
Also, earning a MBA, while admirable, isn't going to make you more competitive for a police officer recruit job. You already have much more than the requisite education for the job, and should concentrate on following through with the process.
Best of luck in your decision.
Kona
Posted by Kona
- May 18, 2004, 06:57 AMQuote from: luke272 on May 18, 2004, 03:59 AM
I agree with you Kona on everything but this statement. This is not true. You can simply state that you forgot to put it down on your application. I explained that to my investigator with a department since and had no problem at all. I did however have a lot of explaining to do. I would definitely not lie about it because you will get caught on your fingerprints.
Luke,
Bottom line here is that you had to admit to applying to another department after you conveniently "forgot" to put it down on your application. Was it worth "forgetting" and then having to do a tap dance for the BI afterwards? I doubt it. Wouldn't it have just been easier to tell the truth, and not have to do all the explaining after the fact? With another BI at a different police department, you very well could have been DQ'ed on the spot for that "omission."
Nuff said.
Kona
Posted by spruceland
- May 18, 2004, 04:41 AMThanks guys,
I received a conditional offer of employment around 5-6 times. I actually smile and throw that letter in my drawer when it comes in the mail because there's always something that messes it up. I call it the "Al Bundy" syndrome.
I have actually TESTED a total of around 45 times. Many of those times, I didn't get a history packet nor did I not score high enough to continue. As I tested more, I got better (remember this is a period of 10 years). One agency I tested 5 times with, another 6 agencies I tested 3 times times over, and a couple of others twice. And the rest were different cities and a couple out of state. I received a background packet around twelve-fourteen times (a lot of those times, I was not competitive enough and my name just expired from the list with no further action), and have been finger printed by eight different agencies. Since I earned my B.A. four years ago, I have only tested a total of 3 times and have ranked pretty high, but sure enough that one background investigators comments are messing me up, even when I explain what happened.
I am really hoping you guys are wrong and am thinking about chancing it, OR waiting a couple of years and earning my MBA and then applying and explaining. I guess I have a decision to make.
Thank you all!
I received a conditional offer of employment around 5-6 times. I actually smile and throw that letter in my drawer when it comes in the mail because there's always something that messes it up. I call it the "Al Bundy" syndrome.
I have actually TESTED a total of around 45 times. Many of those times, I didn't get a history packet nor did I not score high enough to continue. As I tested more, I got better (remember this is a period of 10 years). One agency I tested 5 times with, another 6 agencies I tested 3 times times over, and a couple of others twice. And the rest were different cities and a couple out of state. I received a background packet around twelve-fourteen times (a lot of those times, I was not competitive enough and my name just expired from the list with no further action), and have been finger printed by eight different agencies. Since I earned my B.A. four years ago, I have only tested a total of 3 times and have ranked pretty high, but sure enough that one background investigators comments are messing me up, even when I explain what happened.
I am really hoping you guys are wrong and am thinking about chancing it, OR waiting a couple of years and earning my MBA and then applying and explaining. I guess I have a decision to make.
Thank you all!
Posted by luke272
- May 18, 2004, 03:59 AMQuoteI am just one person with an opinion here, but I feel that if you lie about the other agencies that you applied to, you WILL get caught, and that open door to law enforcement will become closed and locked.I agree with you Kona on everything but this statement. This is not true. You can simply state that you forgot to put it down on your application. I explained that to my investigator with a department since and had no problem at all. I did however have a lot of explaining to do. I would definitely not lie about it because you will get caught on your fingerprints.
Posted by Kona
- May 18, 2004, 03:34 AMQuote from: spruceland on May 17, 2004, 11:03 PMI have no criminal history and basically have a perfect background except for the fact that I've tested with too many agencies (over 50 times- some repeated).
Holy cow!! Over 50 agencies, repeatedly??? How did you deal with all the paperwork? I was worn out after applying to two different agencies with all the paperwork, personal history statements, etc.
Maybe some of the police departments in question felt that you didn't have a clue what you really wanted after seeing that you applied to 50+ departments. However, that in itself shouldn't have DQ'ed you from any particular agency.
Quote from: spruceland on May 17, 2004, 11:03 PMSo whoever said honesty is the best policy probably didn't get anywhere. I truly feel that by omitting some of the agencies I've tested with will open the door to law enforcment for me.
I am just one person with an opinion here, but I feel that if you lie about the other agencies that you applied to, you WILL get caught, and that open door to law enforcement will become closed and locked.
Quote from: spruceland on May 17, 2004, 11:03 PM.
Besides, what is it to them that I tested with another agency? It was my time and my efforts. As long as I didn't do anything wrong, it's none of their business.
Wrong. It's their business because you are applying to their agency, and they want to know. Maybe the question is nothing more than an integrity check. If you get caught in a bold faced lie like this, you won't have any integrity in their eyes, and you definitely won't get the job.
Quote from: spruceland on May 17, 2004, 11:03 PMThey could do their own background instead of being lazy and asking other people who didn't do their job well in the first place. So that's that. No more Mr. Nice Guy. As the saying goes: nice guys do finish last (NO MORE) And I'm going to do whatever I can to get hired>
Spruceland, I don't think that the attitude displayed above is going to win any hearts and minds in the police department's Background Investigator's office. Hopefully, that attitude won't show when you are conducting your interview.
I have one question for you......were you offered a job by ANY of the 50+ agencies that you applied?
Regards,
Kona
Posted by luke272
- May 18, 2004, 01:03 AMQuoteYou have just discovered proof that the people on this board are full of shit. And you will find that George, Anonymous, and Triple Excrement are the biggest bullshitters in this group of bullshitters
Hey if you want to take the advice of assholes like this go ahead.
I don't care what you have heard your prints stay with you for life and will come up every single time a law enforcement agency runs them during the hiring process. How do I know? I lied to a police department in another state about it and got caught. I learned the hard way. After doing tons of research and talking to actual police department investigators I found out it is with you for life. ANY time you are printed for law enforcement employment it comes back on your fingerprints. Hey you don't believe me? Lie and get DQ'd. Not my problem, I contacted everyone including lawyers and found out there is no way around it. I'm trying to help you out as someone who has been in a similar position. Do some research on the topic and you will see I am 100% correct.
Posted by spruceland
- May 17, 2004, 11:03 PMThank you, I'm going to need the luck.
Honesty isn't always the best policy. I don't drink, smoke and have never done drugs. I am a good person. I earned a B.A. in law enforcement. When I first started testing, they said I lacked life experience. As I tested more and got my degree, my scores got better and my interview skills did too. I graduated with a 90% grade point average. I eat, sleep, drink, breathe police officer. I have no criminal history and basically have a perfect background except for the fact that I've tested with too many agencies (over 50 times- some repeated). In a mid size department (with less than 200 officers) I can score in the top 10 most of the time.
When I tested with L.A. , they passed me, but when the information came back from the example I gave above, they failed me on the pyschological for whatever reason, which to this day still haunts my endeavors. A couple of other agencies I've tested with had background investigators that really could have cared less if I got hired. I have passed 3 backgrounds, 8 polygraphs, 3 psychologicals. When I test with agencies, they look my long list of agencies I 've tested with, and I know they think I'm a reject or something. Testing became kind of a hobby when I was younger; I wish I never tested as much as I did. The funny thing is that most LE officers and techers said just keep testing and that's exactly what I did. I decided to try the honesty approach one last time with an agency I tested with last year. I was their #3 guy and everything was going fine. They asked me to write a letter explaining my expereinces with the agencies, which was a 7 page explanation letter of my experiences with various departments and why I thought they didn't hire me. Guess what their reply was. You're a nice guy, but our Chief is looking for squeeky clean people. And my official denial letter said: Thank you for testing, but there were other higher qualified candidates, which is total b.s.!
So whoever said honesty is the best policy probably didn't get anywhere. I truly feel that by omitting some of the agencies I've tested with will open the door to law enforcment for me. This is something I really want to do, and it's been 10 years and I'm still standing here hoping that I get hired. I do somewhat feel bad about omitting this tiny fact but I know if I don't, I won't have my career. I don't want to go through life thinking should have, could have, would have. Everytime I see a police officer, my heart sinks because I think that should be me.
Besides, what is it to them that I tested with another agency? It was my time and my efforts. As long as I didn't do anything wrong, it's none of their business. They could do their own background instead of being lazy and asking other people who didn't do their job well in the first place. So that's that. No more Mr. Nice Guy. As the saying goes: nice guys do finish last (NO MORE) And I'm going to do whatever I can to get hired>
Honesty isn't always the best policy. I don't drink, smoke and have never done drugs. I am a good person. I earned a B.A. in law enforcement. When I first started testing, they said I lacked life experience. As I tested more and got my degree, my scores got better and my interview skills did too. I graduated with a 90% grade point average. I eat, sleep, drink, breathe police officer. I have no criminal history and basically have a perfect background except for the fact that I've tested with too many agencies (over 50 times- some repeated). In a mid size department (with less than 200 officers) I can score in the top 10 most of the time.
When I tested with L.A. , they passed me, but when the information came back from the example I gave above, they failed me on the pyschological for whatever reason, which to this day still haunts my endeavors. A couple of other agencies I've tested with had background investigators that really could have cared less if I got hired. I have passed 3 backgrounds, 8 polygraphs, 3 psychologicals. When I test with agencies, they look my long list of agencies I 've tested with, and I know they think I'm a reject or something. Testing became kind of a hobby when I was younger; I wish I never tested as much as I did. The funny thing is that most LE officers and techers said just keep testing and that's exactly what I did. I decided to try the honesty approach one last time with an agency I tested with last year. I was their #3 guy and everything was going fine. They asked me to write a letter explaining my expereinces with the agencies, which was a 7 page explanation letter of my experiences with various departments and why I thought they didn't hire me. Guess what their reply was. You're a nice guy, but our Chief is looking for squeeky clean people. And my official denial letter said: Thank you for testing, but there were other higher qualified candidates, which is total b.s.!
So whoever said honesty is the best policy probably didn't get anywhere. I truly feel that by omitting some of the agencies I've tested with will open the door to law enforcment for me. This is something I really want to do, and it's been 10 years and I'm still standing here hoping that I get hired. I do somewhat feel bad about omitting this tiny fact but I know if I don't, I won't have my career. I don't want to go through life thinking should have, could have, would have. Everytime I see a police officer, my heart sinks because I think that should be me.
Besides, what is it to them that I tested with another agency? It was my time and my efforts. As long as I didn't do anything wrong, it's none of their business. They could do their own background instead of being lazy and asking other people who didn't do their job well in the first place. So that's that. No more Mr. Nice Guy. As the saying goes: nice guys do finish last (NO MORE) And I'm going to do whatever I can to get hired>