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fakunbakun
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Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Apr 22nd, 2011 at 12:48am
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I am a student currently making my way through a Southern (undisclosed due to the possibility of it comin back to my comp) Police Academy as a part of my bachelors degree program.

I am supposed to graduate in just shy of 5 weeks, and already have offers on the table for various departments in my state.

My question for you guys is if heart beat manipulation is a reasonable countermeasure to the standard polygraph examination. As a foreword, I was in a car crash a few years ago, and as a result of the impact... my heart stopped. Since that time, I have been able to increase the beat substantially or decrease it to only several beats per minute at my will.

Will a "seasoned and professional" examiner be able to get me on it and say I cheated? Or should I be okay if I keep it steady and at a reasonable beat in addition to steady breathing?

Thanks for your time.
  
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stefano
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #1 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 1:04am
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fakunbakun wrote on Apr 22nd, 2011 at 12:48am:
Since that time, I have been able to increase the beat substantially or decrease it to only several beats per minute at my will

Amazing, I've never heard of this before--I would sure like to get you into my lab and wire you up. Manipulated heart rate alone would not be a good countermeasure, it should be used in concert with other methods. Please read The Lie Behind the Lie Detector.
  
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Twoblock
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #2 - Apr 22nd, 2011 at 3:10am
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stefano

I would certainly yield to to George but, I believe that increasing the heart rate would also increase BP and galvanic action.

fakunbakun

I too can manipulate my heart rate at will. Not so much at lowering but increasing which is the important side. In my research with the machine, when the control question is indentified, I think of face to face with a grizzly bear. However, I had to guard against overexposure to that thought, since I have personally had face to face encounters with bears, because in 4 or 5 seconds my heart rate will jump 15 to 20 bpm's and that is too much when taking a real poly I would think. Then when a relevant question is identified, I think of laying on a river bank with a fishing pole in one hand and a good book in the other. You only want your heart rate to return to normal. Not below normal. The poly operator can only GUESS that you're using countermeasures. Believe it or not - they cannot read minds.

Maybe George will weigh in on this discussion.
  
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stefano
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #3 - Apr 23rd, 2011 at 4:35am
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Twoblock wrote on Apr 22nd, 2011 at 3:10am:
I would certainly yield to to George but, I believe that increasing the heart rate would also increase BP and galvanic action.

I think you are correct in that a self induced arousal could set off a paradigm of sympathetic reactions. Perhaps I misunderstood fakunbakun. I took it to mean that as a result of some physiological trauma he is able to "selectively" manipulate his heart rate--which would be diverse from the set of reactions resulting from the grizzly bear scenario. Maybe fakunbakun can elaborate a little.
  
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fakunbakun
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #4 - Apr 27th, 2011 at 7:48pm
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TwoBlock,  have you beaten a poly? I have yet to read a legitimate account of anyone on here beating one.

Stefano... A large portion of the selective manipulation is a result of the trauma associated with the crash, although some of it is due to meditation and various other "soothing" methods (mind you, I spent over a month in the hospital and then a few more doing diagnostic tests and talking to heart docs about the resulting tachycardia and brachycardia).

sorry for the delay, Constitutional law is drivin me batty right now
  
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Dare
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #5 - Apr 28th, 2011 at 12:12am
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fakunbakun wrote on Apr 27th, 2011 at 7:48pm:
TwoBlock,  have you beaten a poly? I have yet to read a legitimate account of anyone on here beating one.


These folks say they lied and beat the poly.  And so have I...

https://antipolygraph.org/cgi-bin/forums/YaBB.pl?num=1292698410
https://antipolygraph.org/cgi-bin/forums/YaBB.pl?num=1280085547
  
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Twoblock
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Re: Poly Questions/ Application of a countermeasure?
Reply #6 - Apr 28th, 2011 at 1:09am
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fakunbakun

My research on the machine shows that I can make it read whatever I want it to read. However, at my advanced age, I will never have to take a real poly. I became interested years ago when I found out that our National Security agencies put undue reliance on one machine and one operator.

You need to research these boards more. There are plenty of posters that say they have beaten the poly.
  
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