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Doesn't matter.  I passed a poly at NSA in 1995, then failed one in 2000.  Had 20 years in military intel with 4 successful periodic BIs.

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The only reason you were "stunned" is because 

you probably ASSUMED, like most do, the the test can actually detect lies.  But it doesn't.

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GOOD!  Never admit to anything concerning a relevant question, unless it is the truth.  I have been saying that for a long time!

I am glad to see that those CURRENTLY employed in positions requiring a TS clearance are not LEGALLY effected by these periodic "witch hunts"

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If you failed a polygraph, it does follow you.  I dare say you have a very difficult time getting a federal job requiring a high clearance with a failed polygraph in you background.  When applying for such jobs, you are asked to disclose any previous polygraph tests you've taken.

I actually got a call from the local FBI field office wanting to talk with me about a failed poly at the NSA.   

TC

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Here is my little "Called by the FBI because of the polycrap test" story:


On April 3rd, 2002, at around 2pm (I remember because it was my son's birthday) totally out of the blue, I get a call from a female special agent from the Honolulu office.  This is two years after my failed polygraph at NSA.  She says she and her partner wanted to set up an appoint with me to talk about "national security".   I ask her why me?  Did she pick my number out of the phonebook or what.  She is evasive.  And doesn't really give me an answer. So I press a little harder and she admits it is due to my NSA application and polygraph.  I ask her why she would want to talk to me over the results of a polygraph taken two years ago.  I get another "we just want to talk to you about issues of national security" bullshit answer.

Naturally, I am getting suspicious, and decide to take it up a notch, so I just tell her:  "Look, I get a call out of the blue from the FBI wanting to talk to me about a bogus polygraph test taken two years ago.  Hey, the guy who tested me said it was 98% accurate.  So why haven't you come over and arrested me?"  She get's a little peeved, and says, arrogantly, if she wanted to arrest me, they would just come over and "kick your door in!"

At this point, and especially after I having lost my trust in LE and/or counter-intelligence types, especially due to my experience with the polygraph (i.e. that being trustful and telling the truth just ain't enough and can backfire), I just tell her I will contact an attorney, and call her the next day.

She agrees.  I call an attorney from this board, forget his name Mark something or other.  I explain what happened.  He recommends calling her back and asking:   

1)  Am I under suspicion for having committed a crime under investigation?   And

2)  Is it MANDATORY I met with them.

I call the next morning (April 4th), Hawaii Standard Time.

I tell her I conferred with an attorney, and he recommended I ask these questions.  I ask them.  Her answers are, NO and NO.

I tell her that I decline her invitation to met.

She responds, suspiciously, "Well, why would you not want to meet with us?"  I respond:  "Well, why would I?"

She starts to get a little milder in tone, and sort of drops the facade a little.  She admits that I am not in any trouble, they are just doing a follow-up.  Mentions the WTC 9/11 attacks (which at that point had only happened recently), and that they are updating their information base....etc.

At this point, I am satisfied they are not trying to con me.  And we talk about the polygraph.  I told her in no uncertain terms what I think of the test.  She halfway agrees, reminding me that SHE had to go through the same process.  They explain that since the attacks, they are trying to turn over every rock when it comes to national security...etc.

I explain that the NSA polycrapper just made a big deal about my interaction with a Taiwan government office in Honolulu, and trips I made to Taiwan.  I explained that I had already met with the Naval Investigative Service in 1992 before retiring from the Navy in 1994 (Chinese Linguist).   Got debriefed for three hours by them, and they didn't have any problem with that, as I kept my clearance and access SCI two years after that (1992-94).  She agreed that she didn't understand why NSA would have a problem with that.

We ended the phoncon amicably.  She even apologized for me and hoped that my experience would not stop me from ever contacting them if anyone suspicious started asking questions about what I did in the Navy...etc.

TC

mls10,

Keep checking back.   

It is dinner time here in Hawaii now, bed time on the east coast.

The board moderator, GM, lives in Holland.  I believe it is morning there now.  So he should read your post soon.

TC

P.S.  You may still have a chance since you did NOT make any "eye brow raising" admissions.  You are at an advantage being in LE.  You probably know about the "interrogation games" played in LE to get people to talk.  Most  people don't.  And these same games are played during the polygraph.

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Ditto for NSA retests.  I was retested by NSA at Camp Smith Hawaii the summer of 2000.  I got the same impression (i.e. that they were just trying to appear "fair") This is even more the case when the hiring committee and security get into a "pissing contest" over the hiring of an applicant, as in my case.

TC

[quote]Actually, no. Not ditto for NSA retests. Your experience is not typical. It's not unusual for NSA applicants who go on to be hired to sit for as many as three pre-employment polygraph sessions. In this respect, the FBI's and NSA's retest policies are not comparable.
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GM,

I was tested twice at Ft. Meade during my preemployment processing.  Once by one polygrapher on one day, a second test the day after by another polygrapher.  During the second test, they did the post test interrogation (where they start yelling at you and calling you a liar).  I pulled the straps off and told her I thought the test was "bogus".  Also mentioned how Alrich Ames had passed...etc.

To my surprise, I got a call a few months later from the personnel  office wanting to know if I would be willing to do a third test in hawaii.  I never requested a "retest".  The hiring committee wanted me to get another chance.

You know as well as I, the polygraph folks ain't gonna pass anyone who erupts in anger during a post test and evokes the name of Mr. Eames.  That's like putting sand in their condom    But they had to satisfy the hiring committee.  I don't think they had any intention of passing me during the retest.

TC

I doubt that requesting your FBI file under the Privacy Act would result in any adverse consequences beyond those you already face as a result of your polygraph results. If the polygrapher has reported that you admitted something that you didn't, you can contest that in writing, and you might also want to consult with a lawyer regarding what other recourse, if any, you might have.

mls10,

Maybe some of the polygraphers who frequent this board can offer some of their self-serving advice.  A typical response goes something like this:

"Gee, there must have been something bothering you about that question.  Probably because you didn't fully disclose everything.  The polygrapher was there to HELP you.  Why didn't you put your full trust in him?  At any rate, no test is perfect.  Now, go join the "pity" party with all the other whiners on this board who THINK they are "false" positives  BTW, what makes you so ENTITLED to a job in LE?  Have a nice day!"