retcopper wrote on Jul 24^th, 2006 at 5:04pm:


OK, KM, since I never really expected a polygrapher to answer the difficult questions anyway, I won't.

It's a pad that some examiners will have you sit on.  It's pretty sensitive, and only detects movement.  I've never heard of it being incorporated into the chair itself, but I suppose it's possible.

Sergeant1107 states it clearly.  If the polygraph were truly an effective, reliable devise, it would be able to detect (scientifically) when someone is telling the truth or being deceptive regardless of the way one may breathe.

I think this is a touchy subject for examiners because breathing is one input that the tester can consciously control.  If there are only minimal variations in the breathing patterns throughout the test questions, this will somewhat eliminate that variable all together.  Compound that with deliberate fluctuations on CQs and you have skewed up to half of their data.

The following informed commentary was forwarded to AntiPolygraph.org with a request that it be posted anonymously:

Underlyingtruth,
 
You write:

Quote:

 
Although you are correct in your assertion that the respiratory channel can be manipulated knowledgably, at will, and under control by the examinee, the phenomenon is much more all-encompassing and significant than you realize.  Polygraphers are taught that there are roughly a dozen or less scorable respiratory responses (see various AntiPolygraph.org reading room documents outlining these responses)* that you and anyone can be taught to produce with about 5 minutes of practice.  Let me repeat--not only can you generally affect the respiratory channels, but also you can easily and specifically produce the responses to control questions that are widely recognized and scored.   
 
Adding even more significance to this phenomenon is the fact that the eletrodermal (sweating) center and the respiratory center are in close proximity in the medulla of the examinee's brainstem.  Trust me--lol---this little bit of anatomical trivia does have some significance--almost any manipulation involving respiration (because of the cross or dual activation of the two centers) will be mirrored in some way in the electrodermal channel, i.e., you get twice the bang for your buck as it were, i.e., affecting two dependent variables (respiration and sweating) for your efforts at manipulating one (respiration).  This latter connection is so well known in polygraph circles, that your examiner would like you to take a deep breath before the substantive test without his instructing you to do so just to see if the electrodermal channel is functioning properly. Make no mistake--taking a deep breath at control questions (or any other point within the exam) is not a successful respiratory countermeasure (either thought by your examiner to be a countermeasure or an artifact leaving you likely to be accused of the former), but producing the known and widely scored respiratory pattern alterations (part of the public record available to everyone on this site) is most definitely one part of a logical route for successful countermeasure effort(s).

* Note: See, especially, the DoDPI Numerical Evaluation Scoring System. --AntiPolygraph.org Administrator

Nonombre,

You write in part:

"Look at your watch, Okay, now do you best to take no more than 2 breaths in the next 20 to 25 second period.  Does that feel natural?  Do you think that looks natural?  Go ahead, practice for awhile.  Does that feel natural yet?  Is your body feeling a little oxygen starved?  Go ahead, keep it up for awhile..."

Where do you get that anyone on this message board thinks we can only take one to two breaths per 20 to 25 seconds during a polygraph exam.? Obviously, this does not feel natural, who ever said that it did.? With a little focused attention and a few minutes of practice, anyone can learn to control their breathing rate, 4-seconds per breath... or, 2 seconds in, and 2 seconds out. Not to exceed no more than 4-seconds per breathing cycle.

If you think someone trying to control their breathing would actually take only one or two breaths per 20 to 25 seconds would be foolish. I would have to agree with you on this issue. It would obviously appear that the examinee is holding their breath if only they only took one to two breaths per 20/25 seconds.

Who on this board would argue with you on that... you're right! They would be foolish. 

Those of us that have actually taken polygraphs and employed cm's which include controlled breathing rates know that you should maintain a breathing rate of approximately 4-seconds per breathing cycle, in & out = 4 seconds. 

No argument with you on the one to two breathes per 20 to 25 seconds here... 


triple x

alterego1,

I completely agree with you... anyone who goes into a polygraph trying to breathe only once or twice every 20/25 seconds deserves to fail. That's completely idiotic.

What post did Nonombre get the idea that someone would want to basically hold their breath during a polygraph? Actually, I think there is a short reference in Doug Williams book, "How to sting the polygraph" that describes holding your breath for short periods during a polygraph exam. However, I would have to go back and read his book again, but I think even Doug Williams advised against holding your breath during a polygraph.

v/r
triple x

Nonombre,

Fair enough, understood.

Just curious... what do the polygraph examinee's say in response to you questioning their breathing rate of one or two breaths per 20/25 seconds.? 

Do they actually admit that they were trying to control their breathing, or, do they tell you that they did not realize they were only taking one to two breaths per 20/25 seconds?


triple x