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Did I pass?
Feb 26th, 2004 at 8:19pm
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I underwent a polygraph examination for a federal law enforcement position approximately eight weeks ago and still have not heard if I passed/failed.

At the conclusion of the exam, I was told it was "obvious" I had issues relating to the drug questions, specifically use and selling (acting as a middle-man in a drug deal).  Of course, this was completely false and I stuck to my guns and denied such involvement.  I only admitted to what was true and in my paperwork (marijuana experimentation 10+ years ago).  I did mention that I might have been bothered by the fact that a family member had been arrested and served time for possessing and selling illegal drugs.  He/she responded that that would not have affected the results.

I am currently employed by another federal law enforcement agency and it was suggested that maybe I had mishandled drug evidence and that was what was bothering me.  Also not true.   I informed him/her that I had undergone (more than one) BI in the past five years because of the clearances I hold and each has corroborated the information on my application.  He/she did not want to hear this.

It was very difficult for me to not become irritated by such suggestions, but I maintained my composure.  He/she must have "forgotten" that I was already part of the "fraternity" and experienced in interrogation tactics (it was my belief he/she was not entirely forthright during the post-exam interrogation).

He/she never told me I "failed," but that was clearly how I felt when I left. He/she told me that he/she could not conduct additional tests unless I provided him/her with additional information.  Again, as no additional information was available, I had nothing more to offer other than my previous explanation (familial drug conviction).  He/she told me HQ would make the final decision.  After almost two months, I have not heard anything other than on more than one occasion after inquiring, that it was being "processed."

I hate to speculate, but I wouldn't think it would take this long to send me a BQA letter.  But then again, I felt I had failed when I left.

I only learned of this site after the poly and I did not attempt any CM.  I relied on the truth (and to think doing so left me open to suggestions that I have not only used drugs while in my current position (undergone two urine tests - negative), but also involved in the selling of drugs.

Any input/observations would be appreciated.

Regards,
Anonymous
  
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Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Marty
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #1 - Feb 26th, 2004 at 10:20pm
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I underwent a polygraph examination for a federal law enforcement position approximately eight weeks ago and still have not heard if I passed/failed.
....
I am currently employed by another federal law enforcement agency and it was suggested that maybe I had mishandled drug evidence and that was what was bothering me.  Also not true.   I informed him/her that I had undergone (more than one) BI in the past five years because of the clearances I hold and each has corroborated the information on my application.  He/she did not want to hear this.

You can take some comfort in knowing polygraphy is not an exact science - nor possibly even an inexact science. If you have read TLBTLD you will know why the polygraph is especially inaccurate amongst more honest than average folks. Perhaps you were not sufficiently aroused by the control(comparison) questions.  Do you remember them and how you reacted to them?

-Marty
  

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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #2 - Feb 27th, 2004 at 12:18am
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Anonymous,

Your just another victim of the 'Justice' system!

What happened to you has happened to thousands of other LE applicants, including those already in 'the club'.

Wild, unsupported accusations and then a luke warm closing of,  'Washington decides'.

The polygraph is a fraud! - now you know through your personal experience. 

Keep charging though!!!- If you did fail (in their eyes), it won't necessarily stop you from being hired with another agency.

As these polygraphers continue clearing serial killers, spies, criminal cops and criminal CEOs as truthful and upright citizens, their support base will finally erode.

But as the polygraphers are forced out of their business, look for a sharp increase in pet psychics, hair replacement tonic salesmen and tarrot card readers.


  
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Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #3 - Feb 27th, 2004 at 9:09am
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Anonymous,

The nature of the post-test interrogation to which you were subjected does suggest that your polygrapher scored your charts as "deception indicated" or at best, "inconclusive." But the fact that you were not specifically accused of deception, but rather of having "issues," may be a good sign. It's possible that you passed, but the polygrapher was just fishing for an admission.

It doesn't take eight weeks to review a polygraph chart. It may also be politically sensitive for a federal law enforcement agency to accuse an employee of another federal law enforcement agency of deception on the polygraph. Perhaps your case is being handled differently than it would have been otherwise. But then again, perhaps no news is good news.

You are right in your belief that your polygrapher was not entirely forthright during the post-test interrogation. For example, his/her assertion that your possible concern over a family member having been arrested and served time for possessing and selling illegal drugs could not have affected the results was a blatant lie.
  

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Re: Did I pass? - UPDATE
Reply #4 - Jul 7th, 2004 at 7:18pm
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UPDATE:  After eight months and continually being told still "in process" when inquiring about my status, I learned via phone that a "letter" was on the way.  This letter, I suspect is a DQ/BQA letter. 

I after six months or so, I became convinced I passed, as surely it does not take this long to evaluate my poly charts.  I have yet to receive this letter, but I am not sure what my next step will be.  I am completely dumbfounded as to what/why this happened.  Do I ask for a retest?  Do I let it go? I now find myself trying to prove that which numerous BIs have already proved.

The bottom line is that a federal law enforcement agency has just accused a veteran federal law enforcement agent of another agency, of deception on a polygraph.  I am only now beginning to appreciate the gravity of the situation at hand. This is serious.  I can only wonder what may happen when I have to undergo another BI for my clearances:  Have you ever undergone a polygraph exam?  "Yes".  Did you pass?  "No, I was accused of acting as a middleman in a drug deal, transporting drugs, and tampering with drug evidence while employed in my current position".  It is almost hard not to laugh were it not so damn outrageous.

Not only am I dumbfounded, but I am extremely angry that my integrity has been called into question by a machine and the polygrapher operating said machine.

  
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Re: Did I pass? - UPDATE
Reply #5 - Jul 7th, 2004 at 8:26pm
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UPDATE:  After eight months and continually being told still "in process" when inquiring about my status, I learned via phone that a "letter" was on the way.  This letter, I suspect is a DQ/BQA letter.  

I after six months or so, I became convinced I passed, as surely it does not take this long to evaluate my poly charts.  I have yet to receive this letter, but I am not sure what my next step will be.  I am completely dumbfounded as to what/why this happened.  Do I ask for a retest?  Do I let it go? I now find myself trying to prove that which numerous BIs have already proved.

The bottom line is that a federal law enforcement agency has just accused a veteran federal law enforcement agent of another agency, of deception on a polygraph.  I am only now beginning to appreciate the gravity of the situation at hand. This is serious.  I can only wonder what may happen when I have to undergo another BI for my clearances:  Have you ever undergone a polygraph exam?  "Yes".  Did you pass?  "No, I was accused of acting as a middleman in a drug deal, transporting drugs, and tampering with drug evidence while employed in my current position".  It is almost hard not to laugh were it not so damn outrageous.

Not only am I dumbfounded, but I am extremely angry that my integrity has been called into question by a machine and the polygrapher operating said machine.



After reading your posts over the past few months, I am not at all surprised that you were rejected.  As a matter of fact if you had been hired I would be "dumbfounded and extremely angry" that a person like you would be making a living from my tax money.
  
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #6 - Jul 7th, 2004 at 8:44pm
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The UPDATE post above (July 7) was only my second posting on this board. My first post was on Feb. 26  (genesis of this thread).  I suspect I am not the only one posting as "Anonymous." 

Careful reading of my two previous posts reveal that I am currently employed as a federal agent and thus already "make a living" from your (and my) "tax money."
  
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #7 - Jul 7th, 2004 at 11:48pm
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[quote author=Anonymous link=board=share;num=1077815962;start=0#6 date=07/07/04 at 13:44:51]The UPDATE post above (July 7) was only my second posting on this board. My first post was on Feb. 26  (genesis of this thread).  I suspect I am not the only one posting as "Anonymous."  

Careful reading of my two previous posts reveal that I am currently employed as a federal agent and thus already "make a living" from your (and my) "tax money." [/quote

Sorry, I thought you were that other lying asshole
  
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Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #8 - Jul 8th, 2004 at 8:28am
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Anonymous,

Having had a similar experience myself, I fully understand your feeling of being both dumbfounded and angry at having had your integrity called into question by such voodoo science as polygraphy.

Assuming that the letter you receive is indeed a DQ letter, I think it would be prudent for you to contest the polygraph results in writing and request a "re-test," if only to document the fact that you do not accept the polygrapher's accusations. See Chapter 5 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector for additional suggestions on contesting false positive results.

You might also wish to compare notes with Fair Chance, a registered user of this message board who, as a federal law enforcement officer, had an experience not unsimilar to yours.
  

George W. Maschke
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Re: Did I pass? - UPDATE
Reply #9 - Jul 11th, 2004 at 3:13am
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After reading your posts over the past few months, I am not at all surprised that you were rejected.  As a matter of fact if you had been hired I would be "dumbfounded and extremely angry" that a person like you would be making a living from my tax money.



from your lack of civility and ability to make an argument based on fact, I am confident in the FACT that you probably work at a fast food restaurant where all you are required to do is press buttons which are already conveniently labeled for you.  Therefore, since your present salary entitles you to receive all your taxes back at the end of the year, it really isn't your tax dollars that are paying for anything.   

Unfortunately, I wasn't the first to say this to you, but I will repeat it for everyone because it only gives some insight into the type of loser you really are. 

Only a dumbass like you can manage to misspell "DUMBASS".

  

"But I, being poor, have only my dreams. I have spread my dreams under your feet; tread softly, because you tread on my dreams."&&
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Re: Did I pass? - UPDATE
Reply #10 - Jul 12th, 2004 at 7:36pm
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dimas wrote on Jul 11th, 2004 at 3:13am:
from your lack of civility and ability to make an argument based on fact, I am confident in the FACT that you probably work at a fast food restaurant where all you are required to do is press buttons which are already conveniently labeled for you.  Therefore, since your present salary entitles you to receive all your taxes back at the end of the year, it really isn't your tax dollars that are paying for anything.   

Unfortunately, I wasn't the first to say this to you, but I will repeat it for everyone because it only gives some insight into the type of loser you really are. 

Only a dumbass like you can manage to misspell "DUMBASS".




I wasn't talking to you dimas, but since love to stick you nose in I will answer you.  I was actually playing with variations of your name, you know like dimwit, dumass, etc.   I know that dumbass has a b and I'm sure you do too since you are obviously one yourself.
  
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Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #11 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 11:07am
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Dimas,

I disagree with your assessment that ISBS probably works at a fast food restaurant. His string of (often profanity-strewn) ad hominem attacks over the past couple of months leaves little doubt but that he is an irate polygraph "professional" frustrated at seeing the tricks of his trade publicly exposed.

ISBS's main goal in posting here seems to be merely to drag down the level of discourse. Let's not allow that to happen.
  

George W. Maschke
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #12 - Jul 13th, 2004 at 6:06pm
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Dimas,

I disagree with your assessment that ISBS probably works at a fast food restaurant. His string of (often profanity-strewn) ad hominem attacks over the past couple of months leaves little doubt but that he is an irate polygraph "professional" frustrated at seeing the tricks of his trade publicly exposed.

ISBS's main goal in posting here seems to be merely to drag down the level of discourse. Let's not allow that to happen.



George, you know I provide a valuable service to you and your fellow losers.  I give you a chance to vent your anger at me and blame me for all your troubles.  I mean after all, you crybabies are never responsibile for your own failures are you?
  
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #13 - Jul 14th, 2004 at 6:25am
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ISBS,  

I apologize for referring to you as a fast food restaurant worker.  My experience while attempting to order at the local BK today has taught me that to work at that place you must first not have any grasp for the English language or even be familiar with numbers.  A "number 1"is a "number 1 " no matter how it is ordered, I even held up one finger to assist him and he still messed up.  But I digress, as my BK experience is a whole other animal.

While you have on some occasions made a good point or actually made me laugh on a retort or two, I find it unfortunate that you have not taken the time to register as a regular user.  Sometimes what is posted as ISBS is quite pointless, humorless and really below anyone with any self-respect.   It leaves me to wonder if you are infact the same person or the haploid that attempted to take my order today.  


I for one do not regret my polygraph experiences at all.  If it wasn't for them I wouldn't be who I am or where I am at today.   Do I take responsibility for it?  Yes, I volunteered to take the tests by applying for a department that used them.   Do I think the machine is valid?  Sure it is, as an interrogational tool, but I think it's use as the sole basis to disqualify applicants is a bit extreme.  

Not that it would matter to you, but I feel it is worth mentioning.  I was punished for being truthful to my examiner by telling him I knew how it worked.   With the years I have come to understand the poor guy.  I know this really great card trick and when I have performed it usually leave people in awe, however one day the guy I did it to knew how it worked.  Amazingly, I was resentful towards him and VERY bothered by him knowing my trick.  


Either way, I hope you take the time to register and make an attempt to cut us down and have us vent our anger at you via factual and intelligent argument and get away from the ad hominem attacks.

Sincerely,

from one dumbass to another.  (hopefully that will be the last time we refer to ourselves via an expletive)
  

"But I, being poor, have only my dreams. I have spread my dreams under your feet; tread softly, because you tread on my dreams."&&
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Re: Did I pass?
Reply #14 - Jul 14th, 2004 at 5:05pm
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dimas wrote on Jul 14th, 2004 at 6:25am:
ISBS, 

Either way, I hope you take the time to register and make an attempt to cut us down and have us vent our anger at you via factual and intelligent argument and get away from the ad hominem attacks.

Sincerely,

from one dumbass to another.  (hopefully that will be the last time we refer to ourselves via an expletive)


Speaking of registering, aren't you also registered as Beechtrees, Dave?  And for the record, I never refer to myself as dumbass, although you seem to know it fits you.
  
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