Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3  ReplyAdd Poll Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Layered Voice Analysis (LVA) (Read 47005 times)
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
Global Moderator
*****
Offline


Make-believe science yields
make-believe security.

Posts: 6217
Joined: Sep 29th, 2000
Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Jul 11th, 2003 at 7:21am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
A new company called "V" is promoting what it calls "Layered Voice Analysis" (LVA), a technology that the company's brochure describes as a "Major Investigative Focus Tool designed for professionals in law enforcement, homeland security, armed forces and intelligence and crossed applications in health care industries":

http://www.vworldwide.com/index.html

Note that this limited liability company formerly used the domain name simplyv.org.

See NBC tech reporter I.J. Hudson's recent uncritical reporting on V:

http://www.nbc4.com/technology/2324847/detail.html

It seems that V's reason for being is to find a U.S. market for the "Layered Voice Analysis" software produced by Israel-based Nemesysco Ltd., whose software also was used in the Truster and Truster Pro lie detection software formerly marketed by Trustech Ltd.

Let the buyer beware.
« Last Edit: Jan 21st, 2004 at 9:26am by George W. Maschke »  

George W. Maschke
I am generally available in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 PM Eastern time.
Tel/SMS: 1-202-810-2105 (Please use Signal Private Messenger or WhatsApp to text or call.)
E-mail/iMessage/FaceTime: antipolygraph.org@protonmail.com
Wire: @ap_org
Threema: A4PYDD5S
Personal Statement: "Too Hot of a Potato"
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box suethem
Very Senior User
****
Offline



Posts: 196
Joined: Apr 29th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #1 - Jul 11th, 2003 at 8:56am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  


Another piece of junk for the crap peddlers to sell.

Its only national security- just another business..

I hope that the purse string holders will be intelligent enough to doubt any company that sells "lie detection' and 'love detection'-  but then I am often disapointed.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
Global Moderator
*****
Offline


Make-believe science yields
make-believe security.

Posts: 6217
Joined: Sep 29th, 2000
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #2 - Jul 14th, 2003 at 9:03am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
"V" has caught the attention of the Washington Post, too. See "Software Searches for Truth in Voice Changes" by Ellen McCarthy, 14 July 2003, p. E05.
  

George W. Maschke
I am generally available in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 PM Eastern time.
Tel/SMS: 1-202-810-2105 (Please use Signal Private Messenger or WhatsApp to text or call.)
E-mail/iMessage/FaceTime: antipolygraph.org@protonmail.com
Wire: @ap_org
Threema: A4PYDD5S
Personal Statement: "Too Hot of a Potato"
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box orolan
Especially Senior User
*****
Offline



Posts: 363
Joined: Dec 25th, 2002
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #3 - Jul 15th, 2003 at 12:35am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
I found the sidebar on the Washington Post article to be very interesting. Eyeglasses that flash "She thinks you're a dork" or "She thinks you're a hunk" across the inside of the lens when you ask a lady if you can by her a drink. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
  

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." &&U.S. Supreme Court Justice Louis D. Brandeis
Back to top
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
Global Moderator
*****
Offline


Make-believe science yields
make-believe security.

Posts: 6217
Joined: Sep 29th, 2000
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #4 - Jul 18th, 2003 at 8:49am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
I received an e-mail message from Dr. Richard D. Parton, V's CEO, who explains that the .org domain was chosen because the .com domain was already taken, and he thought as a start-up, the company's time and attention would be better spent elsewhere than picking domains. Dr. Parton wrote that he wouldn't mind answering any questions I might have, adding that the public benefits from informed debate. The e-mail reply I sent bounced back with an error message that his address no longer exists or no longer accepts mail, so I'm posting my reply here.

Dear Dr. Parton,

Thank you for your reply. I agree with you that the public benefits from informed debate. In my e-mail reply to you, I suggested that we carry out this debate here on the AntiPolygraph.org message board.

Your company has made some extraordinary claims about the capabilities of Layered Voice Analysis. Could you direct me to any double-blind studies that support these claims?
  

George W. Maschke
I am generally available in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 PM Eastern time.
Tel/SMS: 1-202-810-2105 (Please use Signal Private Messenger or WhatsApp to text or call.)
E-mail/iMessage/FaceTime: antipolygraph.org@protonmail.com
Wire: @ap_org
Threema: A4PYDD5S
Personal Statement: "Too Hot of a Potato"
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Saidme
Especially Senior User
*****
Offline



Posts: 311
Joined: Jun 11th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #5 - Jul 18th, 2003 at 3:16pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Go getem George
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box devries
New User
*
Offline



Posts: 1
Joined: Aug 1st, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #6 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 12:44am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Whenever you decide that a particular technology is not to your liking, no amount of persuasion or research is going to change the way you view things. I have been working with the LVA technology for some time, and I can tell you that in very simple terms; it works. I know that you do not wish to hear this kind of stuff. I also realize that you would prefer to to have me malign the technology as possible because that is your venue. That, too, is okay. As long as we understand one another. Your job is to totally discredit any technology regardless of its utility. Yes, there are blind studies with LVA, CVSA, Polygraph, etc. I just do not think that any of these studies would be of interest to you since your raison d'etre is "bashing" of all deception detection technologies regardless of their validity.

Dr. Albert  de Vries
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Saidme
Especially Senior User
*****
Offline



Posts: 311
Joined: Jun 11th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #7 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 3:02am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
George

You better refute this lying no good sonofa#&*!.  I think you should also challenge his credentials and his entire work history. Cheesy
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box True Dat
New User
*
Offline



Posts: 5
Joined: Aug 1st, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #8 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 4:24am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
So nice of the good 'doctor' to come down from his mountain and tell everyone his little gizmo 'works'.   Roll Eyes


  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box suethem
Very Senior User
****
Offline



Posts: 196
Joined: Apr 29th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #9 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 4:59am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
True_dat,

The word 'utility' actually means "it scares some people into confessing"

I guess that makes the Doc a 'utility' man, which is a step up from the 'true believer'.  They are the worst.

-Although they usually drink the special punch given to them by the Glorious Leader, and are never heard from again-

Hey Doc, which 'deception detection devices' have been found to have validity?  Not the polygraph (NAS) and not CVSA (DOJ)!!!

Your not Dr. Gelb's roomate by any chance, are you?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box George W. Maschke
Global Moderator
*****
Offline


Make-believe science yields
make-believe security.

Posts: 6217
Joined: Sep 29th, 2000
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #10 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 8:54am
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Dr. de Vries,

You write:

Quote:
Whenever you decide that a particular technology is not to your liking, no amount of persuasion or research is going to change the way you view things.


The only person regarding whom you can really know whether the above characterization is true is yourself...

Quote:
I have been working with the LVA technology for some time, and I can tell you that in very simple terms; it works.


What evidence led you to the conclusion that it "works?"

Quote:
I know that you do not wish to hear this kind of stuff. I also realize that you would prefer to to have me malign the technology as possible because that is your venue. That, too, is okay. As long as we understand one another.


I actually would like to hear the evidence. Dr. Parton has acknowledged in an e-mail to me that there are no double-blind studies of LVA.  Several of Robert L. Parks's "Seven Warning Signs of Bogus Science" are evident in the way LVA is being marketed. Thus, I think you should be able to appreciate why I and others might be skeptical of V's claims regarding Layered Voice Analysis (LVA). Extraodinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

V's key claim regarding LVA that I find to be extraordinary is the claim that LVA can detect deception with an accuracy rate over 90%. Where is the proof? The U.S. National Academy of Sciences states in its report, The Polygraph and Lie Detection, "Although proponents of voice stress analysis claim high levels of accuracy, empirical research on the validity of the technique has been far from encouraging."

V's website states (on the "How it Works" page), "In the late 1990's that all changed with the advent of Layered Voice Analysis. Voice analysis was enhanced by the rapid advancements in personal computer technology. New research was commissioned. When mated with digital sound technology, the results were astounding. Not only were accuracy standards raised above 90% level, but other unexpected results emerged." Where can I find a copy of any report(s) on the research that was commissioned?

The same page on the V website also asserts that, "Mapping the DNA of thought and emotion is now being achieved." Could you refer me to any published research on this purported mapping?

Quote:
Your job is to totally discredit any technology regardless of its utility.


No, Dr. de Vries. It is not our job to discredit any technology. If those claiming LVA can detect deception with an accuracy rate of >90% wish to be believed, then it is their job to prove such claims.

Quote:
Yes, there are blind studies with LVA, CVSA, Polygraph, etc. I just do not think that any of these studies would be of interest to you since your raison d'etre is "bashing" of all deception detection technologies regardless of their validity.

Dr. Albert ?de Vries


Again, Dr. Parton wrote to me that there are no double-blind studies of LVA. Perhaps he is mistaken. Would you please provide citations for the "blind studies with LVA..." to which you refer? Have any such studies been published in refereed scientific journals?
  

George W. Maschke
I am generally available in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 PM Eastern time.
Tel/SMS: 1-202-810-2105 (Please use Signal Private Messenger or WhatsApp to text or call.)
E-mail/iMessage/FaceTime: antipolygraph.org@protonmail.com
Wire: @ap_org
Threema: A4PYDD5S
Personal Statement: "Too Hot of a Potato"
Back to top
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Saidme
Especially Senior User
*****
Offline



Posts: 311
Joined: Jun 11th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #11 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 1:57pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
George and Friends

You made me proud.  Most of the standard bashers came out of the woodwork on this one.  I was a little disappointed on your timing though.  I figured (no scientific study) you'd be out of the gate much quicker.  Maybe I should do a scientific study on that.  Hmmm.  Although I put little credibility in the CVSA or LVA, I find it disturbing (but not surprising) you guys are already off to the races to chop this guy's character and credentials to pieces.  Sad
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box True Dat
New User
*
Offline



Posts: 5
Joined: Aug 1st, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #12 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 6:08pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Saidme wrote on Aug 1st, 2003 at 1:57pm:
George and Friends

You made me proud.  Most of the standard bashers came out of the woodwork on this one.  I was a little disappointed on your timing though.  I figured (no scientific study) you'd be out of the gate much quicker.  Maybe I should do a scientific study on that.  Hmmm.  Although I put little credibility in the CVSA or LVA, I find it disturbing (but not surprising) you guys are already off to the races to chop this guy's character and credentials to pieces.  Sad


What does it say for you when even Saidme thinks your little 'lie detector' is no more useful than a snoopy snowcone machine?  Cry
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Anonymous
Guest


Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #13 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 6:32pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
True-Dat,

You write:

Quote:
...What does it say for you when even Saidme thinks your little 'lie detector' is no more useful than a snoopy snowcone machine?...


Actually it means very little...Saidme apparently hasn’t realized that that which he is using is no better--which hardly gives much credibility to his assessment of somebody else’s quackery.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paste Member Name in Quick Reply Box Saidme
Especially Senior User
*****
Offline



Posts: 311
Joined: Jun 11th, 2003
Re: Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)
Reply #14 - Aug 1st, 2003 at 7:03pm
Mark & QuoteQuote Print Post  
Now we're cooking.  Let's not leave anyone out when it comes to credibility.  Attack us all.  True_dat is going to have to go back to George's basher school.  He/she's a little slow on the up-take.  You should know better than to give any hint of a compliment to a polygraph examiner. Cheesy
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 
ReplyAdd Poll Send TopicPrint
Layered Voice Analysis (LVA)

Please type the characters that appear in the image. The characters must be typed in the same order, and they are case-sensitive.
Open Preview Preview

You can resize the textbox by dragging the right or bottom border.
Insert Hyperlink Insert FTP Link Insert Image Insert E-mail Insert Media Insert Table Insert Table Row Insert Table Column Insert Horizontal Rule Insert Teletype Insert Code Insert Quote Edited Superscript Subscript Insert List /me - my name Insert Marquee Insert Timestamp No Parse
Bold Italicized Underline Insert Strikethrough Highlight
                       
Change Text Color
Insert Preformatted Text Left Align Centered Right Align
resize_wb
resize_hb







Max 200000 characters. Remaining characters:
Text size: pt
More Smilies
View All Smilies
Collapse additional features Collapse/Expand additional features Smiley Wink Cheesy Grin Angry Sad Shocked Cool Huh Roll Eyes Tongue Embarrassed Lips Sealed Undecided Kiss Cry
Attachments More Attachments Allowed file types: txt doc docx ics psd pdf bmp jpe jpg jpeg gif png swf zip rar tar gz 7z odt ods mp3 mp4 wav avi mov 3gp html maff pgp gpg
Maximum Attachment size: 500000 KB
Attachment 1:
X