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Topic Summary - Displaying 13 post(s).
Posted by: Barkerwood74
Posted on: Sep 19th, 2019 at 4:09am
  Mark & Quote
Yes it can be scary. I am off probation now myself but can convey my experience to you. First off, you have paid your debt and it is a solid fact that sex offenses have the lowest recidivism rate of all crimes, especially with treatment. Don't get frustrated with hatful comments from shallow people. You need to stay focused on your treatment and or probation, everything you do can be of help to you or hurt you. Often they look at the big picture when assessing these matters. If you fail the polygraph but have clean slate otherwise and the chances are very low for you to be sent back to prison.

Only in a few states can you challenge the polygraph outright, what many of them do allow is for the scope of the questions to be limited. For instance, some states don't let them pry into things you were not charged with but, instead only if you are adhering to your probation. As George stated, talk to a lawyer!

Having said that, here is my deal: When on probation I failed two polygraphs. One was a sexual history and the administrator made a general accusation, saying that I was hiding a hands on offense of some type. I was never accused or charged of that, and refused to admit to something I did not do and can't even imagine anything in my past to that even could be construed as such. It was never brought up again! I suspect it was a fishing expedition.  From that point on I had to do a compliance check. In that one he showed me a little tiny bump on the readout, smirking and said you know what that means? "It means when I asked you if you have been viewing porn, you were deceptive." Well, I had not and more to the point the genius had also asked me in early questions if I had adhered to the terms of my probation and been honest with my probation officer. I asked him when he failed me on that single issue, if we were done as I was not going to admit to something I didn't do and he said "Yes, you are free to leave unless you want to make this right and tell the truth" I got up and left and called my probation officer and told him I failed, I did not wait, in fact if I farted and thought it could be an issue I called my probation officer throughout the duration of my probation because I wanted him to know that I rightfully respected / feared the situation. I asked him how I could be lying about viewing porn if the terms of my probation were that I not, and that I reported to him weekly and stated on paper I had not, AND I PASSED THOSE QUESTIONS (adhered to probation and been honest with my probation officer). He said it was a good point and they let it go.

The fist rule of probation is DON'T BRAKE THE RULES. The second rule is get vested in your future and make sure they know you are trying to get your life on track. When people do reoffend it is often when they are at a low point "fuck it" attitude and feel no hope or light at the end of the tunnel. If you go down that road, you will get hounded. If you are doing well and fail a polygraph, depending on the supervising agency they will try to be balanced. The third rule is, don't admit to or even suggest "attempt to appease" if you did not do anything wrong, but firmly and respectfully assert yourself. You can also consult an attorney after as well as before you take the polygraph.

Best of luck to you and I hope you get your life back on track and stay offense free...

Posted by: Yugeen
Posted on: Aug 28th, 2019 at 12:34am
  Mark & QuoteQuote
You have a 5th amendment right to refuse to answer questions by the government

People before have refused polygraphs on 5th amendment grounds and the courts sided with them. Never answer any questions without an attorney
Posted by: Dan Mangan
Posted on: Apr 10th, 2018 at 11:15pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote
Joe, here's another scenario...

The SO may have smartened up -- as so many do, dontcha know -- studied CMs, and beat the examiner like a rented mule.

BTW, did you hear the latest from the APA regarding ESS and auto EDA?

Posted by: Joe McCarthy
Posted on: Apr 10th, 2018 at 8:46pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote



I would be shocked if he wasn't already MTR, or will be fighting an MTR by the end of the year. 

If he thinks it's the examiner that can make him miserable, he is going to be in for some harsh wake-up calls  If he hasn't already been snapped back.

I love examinees like this
Posted by: Dan Mangan
Posted on: Mar 5th, 2018 at 12:53am
  Mark & QuoteQuote
ChillyC wrote on Mar 4th, 2018 at 7:46pm:
Why should I fear a test that has no possibility of causing me any worries??

You just don't get it.

Good luck, ChillyC.

You'll need it.
Posted by: ChillyC
Posted on: Mar 4th, 2018 at 7:46pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote
  Why should I fear a test that has no possibility of causing me any worries?? "Failing" a test is not cause for any revocation, this I know to be true far and wide.  Secondly, since I am not doing anything even close to a re offense, why worry??
  What chaps my back side is that "the system"actually thinks they are doing the country something good ... the data just does not support the argument. Full fledged change it possible, those who don't think so end up in a far worse mess later in life. Polygraph testing does nothing to aid this progress from a personal, or collective standpoint. The whole hoax needs scrapped.
Posted by: Dan Mangan
Posted on: Feb 24th, 2018 at 8:44pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote

You remind me of the legendary AP poster Arkangelsk, who also fancied himself the smartest guy in the room.

Polygraph's lack of scientific validity -- with which I largely agree -- is immaterial in your case, as it is with all SOs who are required to take the "test."

You're still doomed.
Posted by: ChillyC
Posted on: Feb 24th, 2018 at 3:46pm
  Mark & Quote
     Thank you for the helpful advice.  Many years ago, prior to coming to I did some extensive research into case law regarding polygraph testing.  I am not all that worried about it at this stage of the game.  I am also waiting on a call back from my lawyer for more specific advice.      I had no idea that gnats could be so narcissistic.  How do you cram so much arrogance into such a small space? It really amazes me.

     I did a term paper in college on parole reform in the mid 90’s.  Within the context of this paper I did some study and research into polygraph testing. I came to the conclusion THEN that polygraph testing was junk science. As far as today, I still have the same convictions; only much more deeply.

     In my estimation, the only reason that polygraph testing is “generally accepted” by the US population as a whole is because of:
1)      General wide spread ignorance of the scientific disciplines
2)      What I call the “deification of science.”

   People must understand that science was brought into existence by imperfect human beings. Therefore, when we say we are “85% certain about X”, we are not REALLY 100% certain about that.  Our epistemological hardware and software has limitations. If we do not humble our expectations we end up putting our faith and trust in things that are not trustworthy (the polygraph produces “test results” therefore it MUST be SCIENCE). Many other factors play a role in our belief structuring; this is one of the many factors.

  In addition, my own profession gives me insight to the lack of validity in polygraph testing.  The test lacks what I call “variable definition and control.”  What on earth does this mean??  Since the polygraph ONLY measures PHYSIOLOGICAL PARAMETERS we must ask ourselves the following: what variables can have an impact on the overall test results (chart readings)?  The answer: numerous.  With this in mind, we must be able to DEFINE, ISOLATE and MAINTAIN those variables in a tight CONTROL BAND in order to have a high degree of confidence that the output test results are the direct result of stress due to someone allegedly lying.

  Anyone with a touch-and-go understanding of data interpretation knows that in order to determine an output reading variable X, you must have a base line comparison variable Y.  Hence, I know through over 50,000 hours experience the ins and outs of the polygraph WITHOUT

   Also, the human brain conducts calculations at a rate of 100 TRILLION per second.  I highly doubt that the American Pharse  Association has the technology to weed out all the “noise” from their supposed test “signal.”

  With the above, I do not need to help me determine the total hoax of the polygraph. Also, with over 30+ years experience with the federal government in one shape or form, I know the game quite well.

  I would like to see fix-a-flat, Dr. Mengele, or any other Voodoo Test Administrator (VTA) prove cause and effect without resorting to STATISTICAL CORRELATIONS. I know this takes the legs out of your arguments, and that your only response will be steeped in anger, a desire for revenge, and frustration associated with the inability to accurately guess the number of red gum balls in the fish bowl at your local candy counter. 

Prove your worth by answering the following:

A group of police officers have breathalyzers displaying false drunkenness in 5% of the cases in which the driver is sober. However, the breathalyzers never fail to detect a truly
drunk person. One in a thousand drivers is driving drunk. Suppose the police officers then stop a driver at random, and force the driver to take a breathalyzer test. It indicates that the driver is drunk. We assume you don't know anything else about him or her. How high is the probability he or she really is drunk?

P.S. I love PCSOT - Pickles, Cheese, Sausage On Toast!
Posted by: Dan Mangan
Posted on: Feb 23rd, 2018 at 4:23pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote
Typical SO victim mentality. From a polygraph perspective, you're doomed.
Posted by: ChillyC
Posted on: Feb 23rd, 2018 at 3:33pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote
First and foremost, i am not seeking any circumvention of any of my supervised release requirements.  I am merely stating that the scientific proof of the validity of the polygraph test is not in existence.  You can not undue my experience with the scientific field, which greatly exceeds what any polygraph examiner can produce. Karl Popper would have a field day with this - do you know who he is??
  The overall attitude of the country is in peril.  When we do not learn how to forgive others and help them reach their full potential in life, the country as a whole suffers; and quickfuix, your future will end like mine, with the grave.  Do not think that you are beyond any falls in life.  I've meet too many who thought they were above the fray and found out otherwise.
Posted by: George W. Maschke
Posted on: Feb 23rd, 2018 at 9:23am
  Mark & Quote

I think you have posted enough personally identifiable information that, if true, your polygraph operator will likely know that you've visited this site and posted here. At this point, editing or deleting your post won't help. It has no doubt been noted and circulated among federal polygraph operators with a "be on the lookout" notice.

The attitude you see from quickfix (a federal polygraph operator) is typical of what you can expect from other polygraph operators.

In Chapter 4 of The Lie Behind the Lie Detector, we describe what we call the "complete honesty" approach to polygraph examinations, which entails informing the polygraph operator that you understand the true function of the "control" questions and other aspects of CQT polygraphy. Doing so will likely lead to an arbitrary accusation of deception and/or countermeasure use by an upset polygraph operator. But it might be your best option under the circumstances.

I think it would be prudent to consult a lawyer regarding your rights and obligations with respect to the polygraph requirement included in the terms of your supervised release.

For details of the kinds of probable-lie "control" questions you are likely to encounter, see my post PCSOT Probable-Lie "Control"/Comparison Questions.
Posted by: quickfix
Posted on: Feb 22nd, 2018 at 7:49pm
  Mark & QuoteQuote
You poor thing;  "inconvenienced" by 8+ years in prison for, what was it again, "computer based sex offense"?  Translation- kiddie porn.  And you have the gumption to come on this site and ask for help on how to circumvent the maintenance requirement of your parole.  Let's hope you are violated back to prison real soon, and YOU get violated IN prison.  A scummy little pimp like you deserves no less.
Posted by: ChillyC
Posted on: Feb 22nd, 2018 at 3:43pm
  Mark & Quote
This past November I was released from the federal system after serving 8yrs and 9 months of a 121 sentence for a computer based sex offense.  Along with all the other inconveniences comes "maintenance polygraphs."
   I spent 22yrs of my life in the US Naval Nuclear Power Program and have a firm understanding of science, test administration, and data interpretation outside of all the information on  With that said, how should I approach my first "test" when it comes up?
  Everything inside me wants to put the screws to the test administrator because I know two things for certain. 1) They can not conclusively prove cause and effect 2) They can not discern the difference between a "true" and "false" positive from a graphical read out.  They will look exactly the same.
  Armed with the information from this web site, I am even more righteously indignant over the waste of time and money.  How should I go into my first test?  As a side note, I have not seen my PO since December 7th and. Last week he came to my house looking for me and I was not home; called him 3 times and left messages - no call back?? Good or bad - not real sure.  Thanks!