Two Irondale City Council members want some answers -- and perhaps an investigation into their own Police Department. 

Councilman Simpson Berry said he has received many inquiries from Irondale residents after questions were raised about an incident in which police say they found a city councilman's son with 3 pounds of what officers believed was marijuana. The 19-year-old son has never been charged in the incident, police and court documents show. 

Berry, who said the city of Irondale also is being portrayed in a bad light on local talk radio stations, said he wants to put an end to the controversy by getting some questions answered. 

"We want the public to have correct information, and we want the correct information," Berry said Thursday. "Sometimes we can be blinded." 

Berry and Councilman Jack Boone called a public meeting for 4 p.m. today to discuss bringing in an outside person to investigate the Police Department. 

"There might be some things we all need to know and possibly consider bringing some additional experts in to look at this whole affair," Berry said. 

"Just from the council, city attorney and the mayor, we need some other people to come in ... and suggest to us some things that we can do and some things we should have done," Berry said. "Maybe some of us are a little too close to the situation."

...

Berry also said he wanted to discuss the demand by Mayor Allen Ramsey that city employees take lie-detector tests after a copy of the police report was leaked to the media, which led to the Jackson incident coming to light. Ramsey wanted polygraph tests to find out who released the report. He since has relented from the demand.

Irondale's Public Safety Committee, charged with handling the internal investigation into who leaked information about the drug investigation, has yet to interview any employees or ask any to take a polygraph test as Irondale Mayor Allen Ramsey had suggested.

Ramsey requested last week that City Hall employees be interviewed and given a polygraph test if necessary to find out who gave a police report about the drug investigation to radio talk show hosts Russ and Dee Fine.

City Attorney Greg Morris said no polygraph tests are scheduled for the near future. He denied published reports that the committee has backed off giving the lie detector tests altogether.

"We may have to (ask for a polygraph), but we may not have to," he said. "We are just in the fact-finding stage."

The plan for lie-detector tests demanded by Ramsey have been abandoned, said Greg Morris, Irondale city attorney.

Ramsey said employees will be interviewed first by the Public Safety Committee comprised of City Attorney Greg Morris and several City Council members. If the committee deems necessary, the employee will be asked to submit to the polygraph.

Ramsey said employees who refuse the polygraph will be cited for insubordination and subject to disciplinary action.

City Council members Ron Bagwell and Jack Boone said Wednesday they would not take a polygraph test.

Irondale Mayor Allen Ramsey is ordering all City Hall employees to undergo a polygraph test to determine who may have leaked confidential police information.

Ramsey said Tuesday night he will submit to the testing and he is also asking members of the Irondale City Council to do the same.

"In leaking confidential police information, those persons are guilty of impeding an active ongoing investigation," Ramsey said.

According to Ramsey, someone made allegations of misconduct in the Irondale Police Department and leaked confidential information to radio talk show hosts Russ and Dee Fine late last week.

The Jefferson County District Attorney's Office is now investigating claims of wrongdoing in the Irondale Police Department.

To: Birmingham News Editor <epage@bhamnews.com>
From: "George W. Maschke" <maschke@antipolygraph.org>
Subject: Polygraph Testing at City Hall
Cc: Mayor@cityofirondale.org, SimpsonBerry@cityofirondale.org, RayJackson@cityofirondale.org, SueMiles@cityofirondale.org, PeteCrye@cityofirondale.org, RonaldBagwell@cityofirondale.org, JackBoone@cityofirondale.org, MichaelMoers@cityofirondale.org, GregMorris@cityofirondale.org, gcox@cityofirondale.org, faye@cityofirondale.org, news@cityofirondale.org, Administrative_Office@12059560950.iddd.tpc.int
Bcc: 
X-Attachments: 

Dear Birmingham News Editor:

Irondale Mayor Allen Ramsey's decision to order a polygraph dragnet at city hall is a mistake (Mayor orders City Hall polygraphs to trace leaks, July 2). Too few people understand how polygraph testing actually works. The dirty little secret behind the "test" is that it actually depends on trickery, not science. The polygrapher, while admonishing the examinee to answer all questions truthfully, secretly assumes that denials in response to certain questions -- called "control" questions -- will be less than truthful.

One commonly used control question is, "Did you ever lie to get out of trouble?" The polygrapher steers the examinee into a denial by suggesting, for example, that anyone who would do so is the same kind of person who would leak confidential information and then lie about it. But secretly, it is assumed that everyone has lied to get out of trouble.

The polygrapher scores the test by comparing physiological reactions to these probable-lie control questions with reactions to relevant questions such as, "Did you leak that information?" If the former reactions are greater, the examinee passes; if the latter are greater, he fails. This simplistic methodology has no grounding in the scientific method.

Polygraph tests also include irrelevant questions like "Is today Wednesday?" The polygrapher falsely explains to the examinee that such questions provide a "baseline for truth," but in reality, they are not scored at all and merely serve as buffers between sets of relevant and control questions.

Investigators value the polygraph because naive and gullible examinees sometimes make disqualifying admissions. But many truthful persons fail the "test." Perversely, the test is biased against the truthful because the more honestly one answers the control questions, and as a consequence feels less stress when answering them, the more likely one is to fail.

Conversely, liars can beat the test by covertly augmenting their physiological reactions to the control questions. This can be done by constricting the anal sphincter muscle, biting the side of the tongue, or merely thinking exciting thoughts. Although polygraphers frequently claim they can detect such countermeasures, no polygrapher has ever demonstrated any ability to do so, and peer-reviewed research indicates that they can't. More detailed information on polygraph countermeasures is freely available on the Internet at www.antipolygraph.org.

George W. Maschke
AntiPolygraph.org