Chris,

How did the individual become an example of why NOT to lie? Did he suffer other consequences besides being dropped from being considered for clearance?

Thanks

What is the procedure for updating your SF-86?  I recently enlisted in the millitary, and  made a few mistakes filling my SF-86 out.  What the ramifications for alerting the millitary to the errors?

I'm in the military and have a TS clearance and two other clearances.  Out of about 30 people I started my training with, only one had to submit to a polygraph test (administered by the DIS/DSS).  It was a direct result of information they had uncovered on the background investigation.  I'm assuming he passed because he did get his TS.  My advice is simple.  Don't lie on your SF86/EPSQ (Very detailed security clearance application.  Lots of stuff to fill out).  There are good odds of them finding out that you lied and then you probably will be required to take a polygraph.  You might be suprised about what the services will accept.

Quote:


Zac,

Check this site:
http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/polygraph/dod-2000.html 
for the year 2000 statistics on DoD use of the polygraph.

Notice the stats on the CI Scope usage (since criminal and exculpatory don't matter here).  The CI breakdown for usage is listed:

(1)  Special Access Programs                 2,128
(2)  DIA Critical Intelligence Positions      1,234
(3)  TOP SECRET                                 0
(4)  Examinations for Interim Access to Sensitive
Compartmented Information                   0

Basically , it is the position, not the MOS, that determines whether you will need a clearance.  Note that the Special Access Programs are a step above SCI access.  TS and Interim SCI don't polygraph.

Hope this clears up the question.

Chris 

Lying about an arrest...wow...That takes some stupidity.

-Zac

Sorry for the error, you are correct, it is 97E.  Those individuals, along with 35E (HUMINT Officer) are the ones who use polygraphs as an interrogation tool.  I have never met anyone in the Army who has undergone a polygraph as a routine matter of issuing clearances, foir both S and TS.

Again, if something major pops up during the background investigation which the applicant contests, DIS/DSS may chose to administer a apolygraph.  In most cases, the case file is handles by a subcontractor security company (usually MANTECH).  In a case which generates a security issue, it is then handed back to DIS/DSS, and they determine how to proceed with investigation.

Examples of when the polygraph has been brought in?  Good question.  My guess would only be for counter-intelligence issues.  I had an applicant once who stated that he was never arrested on his application.  He was looking to change MOS to one requiring a clearance.  But after receiving his FBI file, I saw he was arrested for assault with a deadly weapon, and using a firearm with intent to maim or kill.  He even had jail time.  And what happened to him?  He was respectfully dropped from consideration for a clearance.  He also became a great example for me as why NOT to lie on your application.

Chris

"Again, don't worry about the drugs if they are a thing of the past, and don't worry about the polygraph.  Unless you are a 96E, you won't see them."

What's a 96E?  You're talking about the Army right?  I know that there is a 97E... The Human Intelligence Collector...

So what is the MOS (in the army) where you will "see" polygraphs?  Please elaborate.

Thanks for reading

-Zac

Zac82

Regarding your questions, see Chapter 8 (Use of the Polygraph in Security Clearance Investigations) of Security Clearances and National Security Information: Law and Procedures, which was written by Sheldon I. Cohen for the Defense Personnel Security Research Center. The entire document may be downloaded as a 17 mb scanned PDF file through the Defense Technical Information Center by searching under Accession Number ADA388100 at http://stinet.dtic.mil/str/tr4_fields.html.

"An applicant for a military security clearance generally does not routinely undergo a polygraph examination. When adjudicately significant issue information is developed during the personnel security investigation and is unresolved, then you WILL be asked to undergo an examination."

What would constitute adjudicately significant issue information?  What would be a few examples?  Lying about international relations? Finances? Employment Records?

Also, how are these issues resolved during the investigation?  If someone says something bad about the person being investigated, how can an investigator tell if that person is telling the truth?  If he/she can't tell if it is the truth, do they just resort to using the polygraph?  Basically, when does an investigator decide that the issue can only be resolved by using the polygraph test?

Thanks for reading.

-A curious 20 yr old.

Guest,

With matters like the David Tenenbaum polygraph fiasco, http://www.antipolygraph.org/litigation/tenenbaum/second-amended-complaint.shtml, you're right--there's no need for DIS/DSS to shoulder anybody else's blunders.  In the polygraph world there's plenty of error to go around...

Hey stupid, it wasn't DIS/DSS who did her examination. Check your facts before you go off half cocked! How very much like you fools!

Dave,

No doubt DIS/DSS has and does resolve many issues with a polygraph exam.  Presumably the Ana Montes polygraph debacle is an example of this sort of resolution--just not a very successful one--perhaps even accurately described as a disastrous resolution, yes?   

"The longer check extends the time to get the final clearance - expect at least a year.  YOU WILL NOT BE POLYGRAPHED!!!!  The Army hardly ever uses the damned thing."

Chris,

Your post is accurate with exception to the above portion. An applicant for a military security clearance generally does not routinely undergo a polygraph examination. When adjudicately significant issue information is developed during the personnel security investigation and is unresolved, then you WILL be asked to undergo an examination. The Army doesn't administer it, but the Defense Security Service (DSS), formerly Defense Investigative Service (DIS) does. It is a specific issue examination. Of course, one has the right to decline the examination. The DSS resolves a very large percentage of the unresolved issues with the use of the polygraph.

Martin,

I am a former Army Military Intelligence Officer.  Part of my duties was processing clearances (S and TS) for soldiers in my unit.

Smoking pot once or twice in the past will not bounce you from getting a secret.  Dealing pot will, though, and possibly buying.  But the drug issue is mostly focused on current issues, so if it was a one time in the past usage, tell them about it and don't let it bother you.

For a Secret, you will only deal with the SF86 or its newer version, the EPSQ.  After the forms are processed, a NAC will be generated (National Agency Check) to see if you have a criminal record.  If you are clean of major violations, a minimal background check will be performed to verify what you have entered on your forms.  Expect the process to last 6-months to a year.  If your MOS requires it, your duty post can issue an INTERIM SECRET clearance after a favorable NAC.

For a TS, you will again deal with the SF86 or EPSQ.  This time though, the background check will be much more intense, checking not only what info you gave, but whatever is gathered from the field.  The longer check extends the time to get the final clearance - expect at least a year.  YOU WILL NOT BE POLYGRAPHED!!!!  The Army hardly ever uses the damned thing.  You can also get an INTERIM TS from your duty post, but don't bother to request one.  Your duty post can't give you INTERIM SCI access, which means you can't be read on, rendering a TS virtually worthless.

Again, don't worry about the drugs if they are a thing of the past, and don't worry about the polygraph.  Unless you are a 96E, you won't see them.

Hope all this helps.

Chris

I am in the army and have a secret clearance.(mos 31u)  They do not do polygraph test only background checks, if you are clean you can rest easy, if you do have some mess ups u r still probaly ok.  Waivers can be signed for any misdeamenor

Most likely you'll be asked to fill out a SF86.

When you fill out your SF86 (Questionnaire for National Security Positions) there is a section that asks if in the last 7 years have you ever consulted with a mental health professional (psychiatrist, psychologist, counselor, etc).

They also ask about drug use since you were 16 or in the last 7 years.  You can answer how you wish, however one of the questions on the poly is if you were truthful on your SF86.

I'm not sure what clearance levels require a background investigation.  I *think* that you don't necessarily have one for a secret clearance. But you must keep your long-term career goals in mind.  Smoking Pot in high school isn't going to be an issue in the long run.

I would think that in this case, disclosing your minor pot smoking isn't going to hurt you. But that's just my thoughts.  Good Luck.

Thanks for your info...
One other question though, how can they get my medical records if I don't tell them the doctor's name? Is there a data base they can check?

If you are just getting a secret clearance you probably won't be given a polygraph. If you are getting a Top Secret/SCI then you probably will.  For your background investigation they will ask about prior drug use.  If you received counseling it is public knowledge and they can obtain your medical records so it's probably best to be honest about that, rather than be caught in a lie.

Perhaps you could anonymously call a recruiting center and ask if you will be denied entrance into the army because of prior drug usage.

I was given a Top Secret clearance by DIA and I had admitted to smoking pot in high school. However, it was more than 10 years in the past so it didn't really count. When it was time for my poly they only asked about the past 5 years.

I am joining the Army soon and must get a Secret clearance.
Some people have told me to admit everything, ie: I smoked pot once and got caught and had to see a counselor about it (over-reactive parents). These people have told me that I will 
not be denied on these grounds, just if i get caught lying. Other people have told me to admit nothing, that if I do I won't get a clearance. Does anyone have any suggestions?
Does anyone know military procedure for a secret clearance investigation and when I will be asked to take the polygraph?